No More Patience - Winter Meetings Thread

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dmarx114
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Re: No More Patience - Winter Meetings Thread

Post by dmarx114 »

I think it's fair to be skeptical of DeJong for next year.

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Re: No More Patience - Winter Meetings Thread

Post by Farewell Friends »

No, errors are pointless because they're a judgement call by someone else.

DeJong had similar outside chase rates, contact rates inside and outside the zone, overall contact and swinging strikes to Sanchez. I didn't say they had the same walk rate or the same strikeout rate. I didn't say DeJong is as good as Sanchez because he's not. But you're saying his floor is low because of an outside chase rate that was 12 points lower than Javier Baez, who had similar strikeout and walk rates and produced at exactly league average.

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Re: No More Patience - Winter Meetings Thread

Post by Farewell Friends »

dmarx114 wrote:I think it's fair to be skeptical of DeJong for next year.
Yes, but that's different than saying upgrading shortstop is a pressing need or a position where the Cardinals can make a substantial upgrade, which is what I initially said.

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Re: No More Patience - Winter Meetings Thread

Post by Fat Strat »

Farewell Friends wrote:
dmarx114 wrote:I think it's fair to be skeptical of DeJong for next year.
Yes, but that's different than saying upgrading shortstop is a pressing need or a position where the Cardinals can make a substantial upgrade, which is what I initially said.
It's not pressing, but it would be nice to have an option behind DeJong who might be able to step in if he goes Diaz on us.

I guess that's what Yairo Munoz is. Didn't realize he had already logged significant AAA time.

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Re: No More Patience - Winter Meetings Thread

Post by Big Amoco Sign »

I think we see Munoz at some point next year no matter what. Has a great glove from what I can tell. Some good highlight videos. A decent SS-worthy .730 OPS at AAA. If that translates to ~.700 OPS at MLB, then that's a good backup option if his glove seriously outweighs his stick. Bat him 8th and call it a day.

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Re: No More Patience - Winter Meetings Thread

Post by MinorLeagueGuy »

I think Munoz moves to 3rd. Its just a matter of when they decide to stick him there for good.

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Re: No More Patience - Winter Meetings Thread

Post by Big Amoco Sign »

MinorLeagueGuy wrote:I think Munoz moves to 3rd. Its just a matter of when they decide to stick him there for good.
Wouldn't see the point in that. Munoz has some power potential but I think organizationally, they leave him at shortstop in AAA while DeJong proves himself at SS. Munoz, while raw at SS, profiles very well there once his footwork improves (the only issue he even has). His arm is a canon.

I like him better than Tommy Edman that's for sure.

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Re: No More Patience - Winter Meetings Thread

Post by tlombard »

Big Amoco Sign wrote:I think we see Munoz at some point next year no matter what. Has a great glove from what I can tell. Some good highlight videos. A decent SS-worthy .730 OPS at AAA. If that translates to ~.700 OPS at MLB, then that's a good backup option if his glove seriously outweighs his stick. Bat him 8th and call it a day.

Ha! I went to look for highlight videos and the first one that popped up was just titled with his name and over three minutes long so I clicked on it. Yeah. It is a three minute AB where he goes down 0-2, takes a ball or two, fouls off a bunch of pitches in between... and then fouls out to the first baseman. Not quite what I was expecting in the first video.

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Re: No More Patience - Winter Meetings Thread

Post by MinorLeagueGuy »

Big Amoco Sign wrote:
MinorLeagueGuy wrote:I think Munoz moves to 3rd. Its just a matter of when they decide to stick him there for good.
Wouldn't see the point in that. Munoz has some power potential but I think organizationally, they leave him at shortstop in AAA while DeJong proves himself at SS. Munoz, while raw at SS, profiles very well there once his footwork improves (the only issue he even has). His arm is a canon.

I like him better than Tommy Edman that's for sure.
He's played more 3rd recently. its a body thing with him. He has good feet, yes. But it may not be enough to keep him there.

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Re: No More Patience - Winter Meetings Thread

Post by AWvsCBsteeeerike3 »

Farewell Friends wrote:
AWvsCBsteeeerike3 wrote:In terms of last years performance, sure. I think the point is one successful season of 440 PA does not guarantee a guy will maintain that success especially when his K numbers are so high, BB numbers are so low, and per JL iirc his swing % outside the zone is so high.

Hell, you only have to go back a year or so to find a case study in Diaz. And diaz struck out half as much and walked twice as much.
Yeah, he's an uncertainty, but it's not as if the available options are much better or that much of an upgrade. Cozart has been one of the worst hitters in baseball prior to 2017, he's 32 and he's going to cost money for what might be a best case incremental upgrade on DeJong. The rest...well, there is no rest. The Angels aren't giving up Simmons like Amoco suggested; the Giants aren't giving up Crawford, who has his own issues. DeJong's floor isn't so bad that the Cardinals need to scramble to replace him, unless that guy is Machado.
I'm not really advocating replacing DeJong at this point, but I'd also have a plan B readily available. Maybe that's Garcia. My only point was that I wouldn't be surprised at all if he regressed and that is based solely on his lack of ability to walk. Those guys tend to fall off cliffs.

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