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 Post subject: Re: Machado
PostPosted: January 11 19, 8:11 am 
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-go birds
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i'm beginning to think machado is a better fit for us than harper.


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 Post subject: Re: Machado
PostPosted: January 11 19, 9:20 am 
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I would have agreed with you 100% prior to trading for Goldy. Now I would say there's an argument to be made either way.


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 Post subject: Re: Machado
PostPosted: January 11 19, 9:25 am 
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go birds wrote:
i'm beginning to think machado is a better fit for us than harper.


He always was. Well, at least before the Goldschmidt move. That complicates matters a bit at least for 2019. I've not been the biggest believer in DeJong, but you can't ignore that he's played at a 4.0 fWAR/600 PA pace for the past two seasons. That's too good to move into a part-time role, when the part-time is going to be extremely sporadic at SS and 3B with Marp/Machado playing those positions full-time.

If you can get Machado at a good value, then you can always move Gyorko and/or DeJong in a trade (though you lose value since people know you need to trade them). Or you just have a bunch of really good bench bats for a season.

It is strange that a Machado market never really developed, since it seemed like a lot of teams were angling to trade for him last offseason. Maybe the asking price is just too steep and/or some of his postseason antics didn't sit well with some teams.


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 Post subject: Re: Machado
PostPosted: January 11 19, 9:30 am 
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Popeye_Card wrote:
go birds wrote:
i'm beginning to think machado is a better fit for us than harper.


He always was. Well, at least before the Goldschmidt move. That complicates matters a bit at least for 2019. I've not been the biggest believer in DeJong, but you can't ignore that he's played at a 4.0 fWAR/600 PA pace for the past two seasons. That's too good to move into a part-time role, when the part-time is going to be extremely sporadic at SS and 3B with Marp/Machado playing those positions full-time.

If you can get Machado at a good value, then you can always move Gyorko and/or DeJong in a trade (though you lose value since people know you need to trade them). Or you just have a bunch of really good bench bats for a season.

It is strange that a Machado market never really developed, since it seemed like a lot of teams were angling to trade for him last offseason. Maybe the asking price is just too steep and/or some of his postseason antics didn't sit well with some teams.


ehh, I get the logjam at position(s), but imo you can't let dejong/marp stand in the way of signing machado.

i know it would never happen, but marp would be a great trade piece. I don't view machado as a SS anymore, so you could still keep dejong in the lineup.

Perhaps a year or two with yadi would set machado down the right path of "playing the game the right way, etc".

It would never happen, but imagine for a moment a lineup that consists of machado, goldy and a healthy ozuna. whew


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 Post subject: Re: Machado
PostPosted: January 11 19, 9:31 am 
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I wonder if the Yankees would make a last minute offer?


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 Post subject: Re: Machado
PostPosted: January 11 19, 9:49 am 
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go birds wrote:
Popeye_Card wrote:
go birds wrote:
i'm beginning to think machado is a better fit for us than harper.


He always was. Well, at least before the Goldschmidt move. That complicates matters a bit at least for 2019. I've not been the biggest believer in DeJong, but you can't ignore that he's played at a 4.0 fWAR/600 PA pace for the past two seasons. That's too good to move into a part-time role, when the part-time is going to be extremely sporadic at SS and 3B with Marp/Machado playing those positions full-time.

If you can get Machado at a good value, then you can always move Gyorko and/or DeJong in a trade (though you lose value since people know you need to trade them). Or you just have a bunch of really good bench bats for a season.

It is strange that a Machado market never really developed, since it seemed like a lot of teams were angling to trade for him last offseason. Maybe the asking price is just too steep and/or some of his postseason antics didn't sit well with some teams.


ehh, I get the logjam at position(s), but imo you can't let dejong/marp stand in the way of signing machado.

i know it would never happen, but marp would be a great trade piece. I don't view machado as a SS anymore, so you could still keep dejong in the lineup.

Perhaps a year or two with yadi would set machado down the right path of "playing the game the right way, etc".

It would never happen, but imagine for a moment a lineup that consists of machado, goldy and a healthy ozuna. whew


I think there's a difference between looking at it from a fan's perspective vs. looking at it from an owner's perspective. For a fan, logjam isn't a big deal. Good bench bats that don't make that much money really (too bad they all bat right handed).

But as an owner, you're staring at a $300MM investment. Yeah they can afford it, blah-blah-blah. $300MM is still a huge investment, even to a billionaire. Think of it like one of us poor folks deciding to buy a new Corvette on a whim, just because the dealership had it discounted by a few thousand. Sure, we can probably afford it and it would be fun to drive around as an extra car. But it probably isn't a very practical investment.


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 Post subject: Re: Machado
PostPosted: January 11 19, 10:18 am 
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Big Amoco Sign wrote:
White Sox will surprise some people. They are trending up and can easily take that awful division sooner rather than later.


They're probably still a year or two away. Getting Machado on a multi-year deal would overlap with that window they are starting to crack open though.


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 Post subject: Re: Machado
PostPosted: January 11 19, 10:39 am 
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The other thing with having a logjam and putting players who have started the past couple of years and are still perfectly capable on the bench for no reason other than you brought in a potential superstar... they'll say the right thing but they won't be happy and their performance will not be what you were hoping for from them in a part time role and has the potential to impact the mood in the clubhouse.

That's my problem with the idea of having a logjam of players and relegating somebody like DeJong to a bench role after the past two seasons.


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 Post subject: Re: Machado
PostPosted: January 11 19, 11:44 am 
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Popeye_Card wrote:
go birds wrote:
Popeye_Card wrote:
go birds wrote:
i'm beginning to think machado is a better fit for us than harper.


He always was. Well, at least before the Goldschmidt move. That complicates matters a bit at least for 2019. I've not been the biggest believer in DeJong, but you can't ignore that he's played at a 4.0 fWAR/600 PA pace for the past two seasons. That's too good to move into a part-time role, when the part-time is going to be extremely sporadic at SS and 3B with Marp/Machado playing those positions full-time.

If you can get Machado at a good value, then you can always move Gyorko and/or DeJong in a trade (though you lose value since people know you need to trade them). Or you just have a bunch of really good bench bats for a season.

It is strange that a Machado market never really developed, since it seemed like a lot of teams were angling to trade for him last offseason. Maybe the asking price is just too steep and/or some of his postseason antics didn't sit well with some teams.


ehh, I get the logjam at position(s), but imo you can't let dejong/marp stand in the way of signing machado.

i know it would never happen, but marp would be a great trade piece. I don't view machado as a SS anymore, so you could still keep dejong in the lineup.

Perhaps a year or two with yadi would set machado down the right path of "playing the game the right way, etc".

It would never happen, but imagine for a moment a lineup that consists of machado, goldy and a healthy ozuna. whew


I think there's a difference between looking at it from a fan's perspective vs. looking at it from an owner's perspective. For a fan, logjam isn't a big deal. Good bench bats that don't make that much money really (too bad they all bat right handed).

But as an owner, you're staring at a $300MM investment. Yeah they can afford it, blah-blah-blah. $300MM is still a huge investment, even to a billionaire. Think of it like one of us poor folks deciding to buy a new Corvette on a whim, just because the dealership had it discounted by a few thousand. Sure, we can probably afford it and it would be fun to drive around as an extra car. But it probably isn't a very practical investment.

Or, if you wanted to put it down to our level, think of it as a travelling salesman paying slightly more money for a better car, knowing that the car will allow him to see more clients and probably make more money.


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 Post subject: Re: Machado
PostPosted: January 11 19, 12:20 pm 
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Famous Mortimer wrote:
Popeye_Card wrote:
go birds wrote:
Popeye_Card wrote:
go birds wrote:
i'm beginning to think machado is a better fit for us than harper.


He always was. Well, at least before the Goldschmidt move. That complicates matters a bit at least for 2019. I've not been the biggest believer in DeJong, but you can't ignore that he's played at a 4.0 fWAR/600 PA pace for the past two seasons. That's too good to move into a part-time role, when the part-time is going to be extremely sporadic at SS and 3B with Marp/Machado playing those positions full-time.

If you can get Machado at a good value, then you can always move Gyorko and/or DeJong in a trade (though you lose value since people know you need to trade them). Or you just have a bunch of really good bench bats for a season.

It is strange that a Machado market never really developed, since it seemed like a lot of teams were angling to trade for him last offseason. Maybe the asking price is just too steep and/or some of his postseason antics didn't sit well with some teams.


ehh, I get the logjam at position(s), but imo you can't let dejong/marp stand in the way of signing machado.

i know it would never happen, but marp would be a great trade piece. I don't view machado as a SS anymore, so you could still keep dejong in the lineup.

Perhaps a year or two with yadi would set machado down the right path of "playing the game the right way, etc".

It would never happen, but imagine for a moment a lineup that consists of machado, goldy and a healthy ozuna. whew


I think there's a difference between looking at it from a fan's perspective vs. looking at it from an owner's perspective. For a fan, logjam isn't a big deal. Good bench bats that don't make that much money really (too bad they all bat right handed).

But as an owner, you're staring at a $300MM investment. Yeah they can afford it, blah-blah-blah. $300MM is still a huge investment, even to a billionaire. Think of it like one of us poor folks deciding to buy a new Corvette on a whim, just because the dealership had it discounted by a few thousand. Sure, we can probably afford it and it would be fun to drive around as an extra car. But it probably isn't a very practical investment.

Or, if you wanted to put it down to our level, think of it as a travelling salesman paying slightly more money for a better car, knowing that the car will allow him to see more clients and probably make more money.


If that's the analogy you want to go with, I'm sure the Cardinals have evaluated the market impact of a Machado or Harper and have concluded that they will not generate an extra $30MM+ for the organization each year. You can argue if that's the correct conclusion or not. I would argue that they likely would not generate that much additional revenue, thus making them a luxury rather than an investment. Then you could argue whether that luxury is worth having around (basically, back to buying a Corvette just because it would be fun to have).


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