3b Options Beyond Machado

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InvincibleCakeEater
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Re: 3b Options Beyond Machado

Post by InvincibleCakeEater »

pioneer98 wrote:
Big Amoco Sign wrote:If you're not getting Machado or Arenado, then keep Gyorko. Donaldson really isn't going to give you more than Gyorko and you're stuck in another big contract you don't want in a year.

"More realistic options" I am glad the fans accept this yearly gaslighting by DeWitt and have internalized it. I don't blame anyone. Just sucks.

Gyorko gives you similar offensive numbers to Matt Chapman. And his defense was considered above average by most here. Has that changed?
Chapman slugged 92 points higher than Jedd last year. The strikeouts and walks a bit more in Chapman's favor, too. All that adds up to like a big difference. It's not really a fair comparison since Jedd is 5 years older.

Jedd is trending downward, too. ISO went from .253 to .200 to .154 the last three years and slugging went from .495 to .472 to .416. I don't think I'd count on Jedd for more than a utility role next year.
Chapman is also a prime Rolen defender.

More to the point, there is no reason to get rid of Gyorko. I'm on board for Donaldson for 3-4 years with a high AAV. Think he has a couple big years left in him. Gyorko to spell him at 3b, starts against some LHP at 2b, PH etc. easy to get him 350+ PA.

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pioneer98
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Re: 3b Options Beyond Machado

Post by pioneer98 »

If the Dodgers sign Machado do they entertain trading Turner? He's also 33 though.

I like the idea of looking at shortstops and moving Dejong to 3B. But there still are not many good options even then outside of Machado. There isn't a need to move Dejong to 3B yet. Someday, there may be though.

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Re: 3b Options Beyond Machado

Post by pioneer98 »

InvincibleCakeEater wrote:
pioneer98 wrote:
Big Amoco Sign wrote:If you're not getting Machado or Arenado, then keep Gyorko. Donaldson really isn't going to give you more than Gyorko and you're stuck in another big contract you don't want in a year.

"More realistic options" I am glad the fans accept this yearly gaslighting by DeWitt and have internalized it. I don't blame anyone. Just sucks.

Gyorko gives you similar offensive numbers to Matt Chapman. And his defense was considered above average by most here. Has that changed?
Chapman slugged 92 points higher than Jedd last year. The strikeouts and walks a bit more in Chapman's favor, too. All that adds up to like a big difference. It's not really a fair comparison since Jedd is 5 years older.

Jedd is trending downward, too. ISO went from .253 to .200 to .154 the last three years and slugging went from .495 to .472 to .416. I don't think I'd count on Jedd for more than a utility role next year.
Chapman is also a prime Rolen defender.

More to the point, there is no reason to get rid of Gyorko. I'm on board for Donaldson for 3-4 years with a high AAV. Think he has a couple big years left in him. Gyorko to spell him at 3b, starts against some LHP at 2b, PH etc. easy to get him 350+ PA.

I think that makes a lot of sense.

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Re: 3b Options Beyond Machado

Post by Swirls »

InvincibleCakeEater wrote:
pioneer98 wrote:
Big Amoco Sign wrote:If you're not getting Machado or Arenado, then keep Gyorko. Donaldson really isn't going to give you more than Gyorko and you're stuck in another big contract you don't want in a year.

"More realistic options" I am glad the fans accept this yearly gaslighting by DeWitt and have internalized it. I don't blame anyone. Just sucks.

Gyorko gives you similar offensive numbers to Matt Chapman. And his defense was considered above average by most here. Has that changed?
Chapman slugged 92 points higher than Jedd last year. The strikeouts and walks a bit more in Chapman's favor, too. All that adds up to like a big difference. It's not really a fair comparison since Jedd is 5 years older.

Jedd is trending downward, too. ISO went from .253 to .200 to .154 the last three years and slugging went from .495 to .472 to .416. I don't think I'd count on Jedd for more than a utility role next year.
Chapman is also a prime Rolen defender.

More to the point, there is no reason to get rid of Gyorko. I'm on board for Donaldson for 3-4 years with a high AAV. Think he has a couple big years left in him. Gyorko to spell him at 3b, starts against some LHP at 2b, PH etc. easy to get him 350+ PA.
Like 4/$100M? Or do you think it would take more than that?

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Re: 3b Options Beyond Machado

Post by Fat Strat »

I think that Donaldson is looking at something less than a 4 year deal. 3 straight years of decline in games played, PA's, and WAR. You factor in his age, and it's not a very attractive picture. Then I think you have to consider the market for 3b'man. Kris Bryant was the 19th rated 3b'man by WAR last year at 2.3. Below him, you have several players (Frazier, Longoria, for example) who are going to be full-time starters. How many teams are really in the market for a 3b'man? Let's just look:

Angels -- they have Taylor Ward
Orioles - they have Renato Nunez and are rebuilding
Padres
Phillies - they do have Franco
Red Sox - they have Devers but who knows what they might do
Royals - rebuilding
Tigers - Candelario
Twins
White Sox

Of that list, I would say the Phillies, Padres, and Twins are the only teams who could aggressively pursue Donaldson. But, as far as spending and winning -- the two things that are likely to attract Donaldson -- it's us and the Phillies. Both the Phillies and the Cards have players they can play at 3b. With Moustakas and Machado also in the mix, I don't see a huge market for Donaldson... at least not enough to force a club into 4 years at $25M per.

3/$60 might get this done and I would love to see 2/$48 with a team option for a 3rd.

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Re: 3b Options Beyond Machado

Post by lukethedrifter »

Every year some rebuilding team surprises with a FA signing it seems. Am i remembering this incorrectly?

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Re: 3b Options Beyond Machado

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This will be Donaldson's only real shot at a big FA payday. I think he's getting something more like 4/$100MM or 5/$120MM, in a limited 3B market.

This isn't the Machado thread, but last night reminded me how much his immaturity irks me. Love the talent, but that immaturity makes it tough for me to root for him personally.

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Re: 3b Options Beyond Machado

Post by Fat Strat »

Popeye_Card wrote:This will be Donaldson's only real shot at a big FA payday. I think he's getting something more like 4/$100MM or 5/$120MM, in a limited 3B market.
I took at look at MLB contracts sorted by length of deal and then considered age. The following is the list of players who got over 3 years at around age 32 or over (some players might have been 31):

Miguel Cabrera - 8 years
Zack Greinke - 6 years
Russell Martin - 5 years
Lorenzo Cain - 5 years
Yulieski Gurriel - 5
James Shields - 4
Victor Martinez - 4
Nelson Cruz - 4
Ben Zobrist
Ervin Santana
Darren O'Day

So, there are some guys who are able to get a 4th year at age 32. Many of them have happened recently. And Donaldson fits well in that group of names.

I'm not sure I want Donaldson for 4 years. It's a real risk. Would definitely prefer a short term, high value, "prove you're healthy" deal, but that's just not going to happen.

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Re: 3b Options Beyond Machado

Post by lukethedrifter »

Is there a Machado aka Johnny won’t Hustle thread?

https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/dodg ... up-of-tea/

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Re: 3b Options Beyond Machado

Post by InvincibleCakeEater »

lukethedrifter wrote:Is there a Machado aka Johnny won’t Hustle thread?

https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/dodg ... up-of-tea/
but but but BAS just says that Manny always hustles through the bag

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