Goldschmidt to Cardinals for Kelly, Weaver, Young, Comp pick

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heyzeus
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Re: Goldschmidt to Cardinals for Kelly, Weaver, Young, Comp

Post by heyzeus »

Big Amoco Sign wrote:Who said this was either/or with Goldschmidt/Voit?

And who said Voit doesn't age?

I think it's fine to question the signing given the plethora of Walkers/Voits/Volgelbachs out there. And when the team had Carpenter. And that doesn't mean I think Goldy sucks either.

Amazing, the power to understand nuance.
Hey, I'm going to post this publicly, so that you can see it as well as everyone else. The bolded part isn't acceptable here. Consider this a general warning to all, and a specific one as to this post.

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Re: Goldschmidt to Cardinals for Kelly, Weaver, Young, Comp

Post by Popeye_Card »

Big Amoco Sign wrote:Who said this was either/or with Goldschmidt/Voit?

And who said Voit doesn't age?

I think it's fine to question the signing given the plethora of Walkers/Voits/Volgelbachs out there. And when the team had Carpenter. And that doesn't mean I think Goldy sucks either.

Amazing, the power to understand nuance.
I think it is OK to question the trade/extension of Goldschmidt in terms of long-term roster management. 1B is generally easy to fill with a good hitter from somewhere. Marp could have stayed there, we have Jose Martinez, we had Voit, there will be more Martinez’s and Voit’s to come.

But it is also hard to find that elite bat, at any position. And the knock on the Cardinals since Pujols left has been that we are great at finding/developing 2-5 WAR type guys. We struggle to get elite guys. We had the cash and the trade surplus to get an elite guy. I’m glad we did, despite the roster inflexibility it has created (and compounded by the Marp extension).

The return for Voit should have been better in hindsight. But teams are also pretty unwilling to give up much for late-blooming 1B/DH types.

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Re: Update: GM Meetings: Paul Goldschmidt & Corner Infield

Post by dmarx114 »

cardsfantx wrote:I do find it humorous that nearly everyone is ok with throwing 10/350 (at a minimum) for a 26 year old harper...

But think Goldschmidt is just a one-year rental and it would be a terrible idea to extend him...

But the last 5 years of a 10 year deal on harper, will be years that Goldschmidt is looking at now for an extension, so you’re paying 35 mil at least per season for harper when he’s Goldschmidt’s age going forward for another 5 years, at least.

But Goldschmidt would be cheaper; would prob only take 20-25 mil annually to trade for him/extend him.

Oh, and he’s better than harper, on a consistent basis (WAR penalizes 1B at def, and he’s still higher on a consistent basis than harper is)

cheaper- check

better- check

Harper is obv younger, so you’re paying a premium for that...but the length of the deal/how long you’d have to sign him for; Goldschmidt would be long gone before harper’s contract is up.
Yup, sure seemed like you were in favor of trading for and extending Goldy last off season.

Mo does what you want him to do and you still complain.

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Re: Update: GM Meetings: Paul Goldschmidt & Corner Infield

Post by cardsfantx »

dmarx114 wrote:
cardsfantx wrote:I do find it humorous that nearly everyone is ok with throwing 10/350 (at a minimum) for a 26 year old harper...

But think Goldschmidt is just a one-year rental and it would be a terrible idea to extend him...

But the last 5 years of a 10 year deal on harper, will be years that Goldschmidt is looking at now for an extension, so you’re paying 35 mil at least per season for harper when he’s Goldschmidt’s age going forward for another 5 years, at least.

But Goldschmidt would be cheaper; would prob only take 20-25 mil annually to trade for him/extend him.

Oh, and he’s better than harper, on a consistent basis (WAR penalizes 1B at def, and he’s still higher on a consistent basis than harper is)

cheaper- check

better- check

Harper is obv younger, so you’re paying a premium for that...but the length of the deal/how long you’d have to sign him for; Goldschmidt would be long gone before harper’s contract is up.
Yup, sure seemed like you were in favor of trading for and extending Goldy last off season.

Mo does what you want him to do and you still complain.
your comprehension skills are getting worse

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Re: Update: GM Meetings: Paul Goldschmidt & Corner Infield

Post by Big Amoco Sign »

cardsfantx wrote:I do find it humorous that nearly everyone is ok with throwing 10/350 (at a minimum) for a 26 year old harper...

But think Goldschmidt is just a one-year rental and it would be a terrible idea to extend him...

But the last 5 years of a 10 year deal on harper, will be years that Goldschmidt is looking at now for an extension, so you’re paying 35 mil at least per season for harper when he’s Goldschmidt’s age going forward for another 5 years, at least.

But Goldschmidt would be cheaper; would prob only take 20-25 mil annually to trade for him/extend him.

Oh, and he’s better than harper, on a consistent basis (WAR penalizes 1B at def, and he’s still higher on a consistent basis than harper is)
Harper is 4 career WAR shy of Goldy's and is 5 years younger.

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Re: Goldschmidt to Cardinals for Kelly, Weaver, Young, Comp

Post by dmarx114 »

Big Amoco Sign wrote:I think we should re-sign him. But my favorite Cardinal, Carpenter, will likely have to move on. And that sucks. But Goldy is going to age well. I'm here for it.
Glad you and Mo are on the same page.

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Re: Goldschmidt to Cardinals for Kelly, Weaver, Young, Comp

Post by Big Amoco Sign »

dmarx114 wrote:
Big Amoco Sign wrote:I think we should re-sign him. But my favorite Cardinal, Carpenter, will likely have to move on. And that sucks. But Goldy is going to age well. I'm here for it.
Glad you and Mo are on the same page.
Yep. I've consistently said Goldy will age well. I don't care about DeWitt's money.

Doesn't mean I didn't want Harper more.

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Re: Goldschmidt to Cardinals for Kelly, Weaver, Young, Comp

Post by dmarx114 »

Big Amoco Sign wrote:
dmarx114 wrote:
Big Amoco Sign wrote:I think we should re-sign him. But my favorite Cardinal, Carpenter, will likely have to move on. And that sucks. But Goldy is going to age well. I'm here for it.
Glad you and Mo are on the same page.
Yep. I've consistently said Goldy will age well. I don't care about DeWitt's money.

Doesn't mean I didn't want Harper more.
Agreed. Just making sure we are on the same page with respect to Goldy.

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Re: Goldschmidt to Cardinals for Kelly, Weaver, Young, Comp

Post by Big Amoco Sign »

dmarx114 wrote:
Big Amoco Sign wrote:
dmarx114 wrote:
Big Amoco Sign wrote:I think we should re-sign him. But my favorite Cardinal, Carpenter, will likely have to move on. And that sucks. But Goldy is going to age well. I'm here for it.
Glad you and Mo are on the same page.
Yep. I've consistently said Goldy will age well. I don't care about DeWitt's money.

Doesn't mean I didn't want Harper more.
Agreed. Just making sure we are on the same page with respect to Goldy.
Sure, but you realize that doesn't mean I'm in favor of the direction of the team. We made the trade, so at that point yeah, re-sign him.

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Re: Goldschmidt to Cardinals for Kelly, Weaver, Young, Comp

Post by dmarx114 »

Big Amoco Sign wrote:
dmarx114 wrote:
Big Amoco Sign wrote:
dmarx114 wrote:
Big Amoco Sign wrote:I think we should re-sign him. But my favorite Cardinal, Carpenter, will likely have to move on. And that sucks. But Goldy is going to age well. I'm here for it.
Glad you and Mo are on the same page.
Yep. I've consistently said Goldy will age well. I don't care about DeWitt's money.

Doesn't mean I didn't want Harper more.
Agreed. Just making sure we are on the same page with respect to Goldy.
Sure, but you realize that doesn't mean I'm in favor of the direction of the team. We made the trade, so at that point yeah, re-sign him.
No, you said re-sign him because he would age well. Not because we had already made the trade.

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