Bat Flips

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What do you think of flipping bats after home runs?

It's a hot dog move with no place in the game
6
15%
Let the kids play
21
54%
I don't care one way or the other
8
21%
Jose DeLeon never flipped a bat
4
10%
 
Total votes: 39

dmarx114
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Re: Bat Flips

Post by dmarx114 »

Popeye_Card wrote:
ghostrunner wrote: Short of talking [expletive] or making faces directly to the pitcher, seems like most anything not harmful ought to be ok.
If a bat flip isn't a non-verbal way of talking [expletive], then I'm not exactly sure what it is.
This is a really good point.

That’s exactly what a bat flip is. It’s non verbal trash talk. It’s done specifically to humiliate your opponent.

Just like James Harden shimmying last night.

Just like any football player who scores a td and spikes the ball in someone’s face.

Just like anyone who dunks on someone and stands over them while flexing.

Someone let me know when a tennis player throws their racket after celebrating a good point, cause I have never seen that before.

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Popeye_Card
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Re: Bat Flips

Post by Popeye_Card »

ghostrunner wrote:
Popeye_Card wrote:
ghostrunner wrote:
Popeye_Card wrote:We do understand that there are slight differences between taunting your opponent in a heavyweight title fight vs. pimping a 2nd inning HR in a non-consequential early April baseball game, right?
I’m not heavily invested in this, but it seems like the options are either the hitter needs to memorize a a a subjective situation flowchart, or the pitcher who gave up the home run can just get over it, try to pitch better next time and pump his fist if he wants. The second seems a lot simpler and more logical.
It really isn’t that hard to figure out.
But there’s more going on for the hitter than the apparent game situation. Maybe he’s been on a dry streak, back from injury, historically done poorly against a certain pitcher or team, or in a certain park. Or just having a good day. Any number of things. The pitcher is free to express himself too, he just shouldn’t be allowed to throw at the batters imo.
Here’s the thing though. There is no penalty in baseball for excessive celebration. Hitters/pitchers can celebrate all they want. You can toss a bat 50 feet in the air and moonwalk around the bases—your HR still counts and you won’t get kicked out of the game. The only thing keeping you in line is the fear of a fastball in your ribs. Just like telling a guy you want to [expletive] his wife—there is nothing illegal about that, but you better be ready to take some medicine.

Meanwhile, there is a penalty for pitchers throwing at people. You throw inside, you are getting at least a warning and taking away that half of the plate. You hit them, you allow a baserunner. You throw at their head, you get ejected at the least and probably suspended.

The game polices itself. I’m OK with that. The “just get the guy out next time” stuff is disingenuous. You tip your cap when you get beat. You react when you get shown up. That’s human nature.

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ghostrunner
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Re: Bat Flips

Post by ghostrunner »

dmarx114 wrote:
Popeye_Card wrote:
ghostrunner wrote: Short of talking [expletive] or making faces directly to the pitcher, seems like most anything not harmful ought to be ok.
If a bat flip isn't a non-verbal way of talking [expletive], then I'm not exactly sure what it is.
This is a really good point.

That’s exactly what a bat flip is. It’s non verbal trash talk. It’s done specifically to humiliate your opponent.

Just like James Harden shimmying last night.

Just like any football player who scores a td and spikes the ball in someone’s face.

Just like anyone who dunks on someone and stands over them while flexing.

Someone let me know when a tennis player throws their racket after celebrating a good point, cause I have never seen that before.
That’s all good except the racket. They still need the racket.

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33anda3rd
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Re: Bat Flips

Post by 33anda3rd »

Popeye_Card wrote:We do understand that there are slight differences between taunting your opponent in a heavyweight title fight vs. pimping a 2nd inning HR in a non-consequential early April baseball game, right?
Sure. And people do choreographed TD dances in the first quarter of a 0-0 game and the cornerback doesn't get to throw something at them. And hockey guys hug it out after a goal 3 minutes into a game and the goalie doesn't get to cry about his pride after he just got beat. And Messi gets demonstrative after a goal to put Barca up 1-0 in the 30th minute and we don't as fans whinge about how he doesn't play the game the right way. And all those things are just like pimping a 2nd inning HR and literally zero people, including the goalkeepers beat on the play, make an issue out of it because we'd laugh at them if they did. We'd be like yo look at that utter puddy tat, why do they even let him out there if he can't take getting beat on a play what a puddy tat.

So why is baseball so god damn precious?

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Popeye_Card
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Re: Bat Flips

Post by Popeye_Card »

Every sport has their own rules for policing these things though. There are excessive celebration and unsportsmanlike conduct penalties in football. You’ve apparently never watched a hockey game to understand how they take care of these things. Or soccer for that matter.

Baseball isn’t unique. In sports or even in society. Anyone can act like a dick. The reason most people don’t is because of the fear of violent retribution. If you don’t understand where lines are drawn between joyful expression and being a dick, well I can’t help you.

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33anda3rd
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Re: Bat Flips

Post by 33anda3rd »

Popeye_Card wrote:Every sport has their own rules for policing these things though. There are excessive celebration and unsportsmanlike conduct penalties in football.
How is this:

Image

...down 21 in the 2nd quarter of a regular season game, different from a bat flip? What is his punishment? What do the Unwritten Rules of Football dictate the other team can do to him?
Popeye_Card wrote:You’ve apparently never watched a hockey game to understand how they take care of these things.
I live in Chicago, homie. We know a thing or two about ice hockey here. I go 5-6X/year and I've never seen the 'Hawks score, the horns blow, the players jump into each others arms, that dumb Chelsea something song play, and the fans then clutch their pearls and act like we should be ashamed of the display over an on-ice hockey goal celebration, which happens about as frequently as a home run celebration. I did a google search for "nhl goal celebrations met with retribution" and didn't really find much besides this:
Remind me, what's a remarkably unique thing about Subban compared to other NHL players?
Popeye_Card wrote:Or soccer for that matter.
This stuff?



This stuff where he basically dances at the goalkeeper after scoring on him? It's the stuff of adoring fan videos. Nobody is like "doesn't play the game the right way." People will hate on him for diving to induce fouls and question his masculinity/toughness, but they'll never pretend he's out of line for rubbing a goal in the other team's face. And it's not just him. Literally every soccer player celebrates goals, whether it's the stoic Cantona

Image

or the Mexican coach wrestling a player to the ground

Image

or the classic knee-slide into the corner for the fans

Image

these happen all the time and they're fun and enjoyed and not considered to be showing up the opposing team/goalkeeper even though they are WAY more demonstrative and showy-uppy if you want to take them that way than a bat flip.
Popeye_Card wrote:Baseball isn’t unique.
It's definitely unique, so is NFL, so is NBA, so is NHL, Euro Soccer, Latin American Soccer, they all have their own things because the demographics of the players and fans are unique.

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Popeye_Card
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Re: Bat Flips

Post by Popeye_Card »

Cool. You’ve seen other sports and know that they celebrate. I won’t bother to pull the thousands of baseball celebrations each year that players don’t have a problem with.

Each sport has its unwritten rules. You don’t mess with the QB in football. You don’t mess with the goaltender in hockey. These are physical sports by nature so maybe it is hard to tell when players retaliate, but they do and it comes with the threat of injury—just like in baseball. All of these sports also police those retaliations. Penalties in football and hockey, warnings and the hitter getting awarded first base in baseball. Severely cross the line in any of these sports and get suspended.

When a hitter dramatically flips his bat or stares down a HR too long, they know what they are doing is taboo within the game. That’s why they are doing it. You can enjoy it. Just spare me the pearl clutching when pitchers retaliate as if that’s unique to baseball. The penalty for breaking unwritten rules in every sport is usually violent.

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MAGA
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Re: Bat Flips

Post by MAGA »

33anda3rd wrote: I live in Chicago, homie. We know a thing or two about ice hockey here.
Image

Arthur Dent
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Re: Bat Flips

Post by Arthur Dent »

Popeye_Card wrote:Anyone can act like a dick. The reason most people don’t is because of the fear of violent retribution.
Pretty sure there are some other reasons.,

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33anda3rd
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Re: Bat Flips

Post by 33anda3rd »

Popeye_Card wrote:The penalty for breaking unwritten rules in every sport is usually violent.
The #1 unwritten rule of the NFL, if there is one, is to not ever purposely harm another player. This is our career, our body is our meal ticket, you don't go out and try to hurt someone. That league's unwritten rules, which are much shorter than the litany of goofy things old guys believe about baseball, are purposely anti-violence, quite the opposite of baseball where you throw at guys' heads and clear benches and stuff if someone hurts your feelings or does something you don't like.

Hockey, who cares. Something like 4% of us list it as our favorite sport, 1/10 of football, 1/3 of basketball and 1/2 of baseball even as baseball is taking a nosedive*in popularity. It's a niche sport in the US, and the only one really with dumb unwritten rules like baseball. The only sport where there is a guy on the roster who can do nothing meaningful or athletic or skilled, who is just there to go fight someone. It's dumb. Who gives a crap what hockey's unwritten rules are because virtually no one really loves hockey.

Soccer, it is plainly untrue that violence is exacted on the field as retaliation. In soccer there are very real on-the-field ramifications for doing something violent. The days of Vinnie Jones, who was an outlier even in his era, are way past. You see a red card, your team plays down and likely loses, it's not a scenario of you see red and they bring another guy in to pitch/hit for you. That's probably the best way to curb stupid violent stuff in baseball: you get booted for starting a fight or throwing at a guy's head, your team can only field 8 defensive players including the P. Would change the game the same way that kind of action changes a soccer match.

*At some time in the near future soccer is going to surpass baseball in popularity and the generation of kids being born now are going to grow up watching more Latin players kicking a ball than white kids swinging a bat. Who will teach this generation that those guys jumping up and down pumping their fists in celebration after goals need to have a ball thrown at their head for upstaging the 'keeper?

Also: how surprising is it that the two American sports with the most Old Man Unwritten Rules About Decorum are the two least popular?

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