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PostPosted: August 9 19, 9:57 am 
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-go birds
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cardsfantx wrote:
sorry, don't understand the wheeler talk when Cole is a FA

if we don't even attempt Cole (like we didn't with Scherzer) then i got issues

I don't want to hear crap about the payroll; they put themselves in this spot with stupid decisions like the unnecessary carpenter extension...that's nearly 19 million you could've put towards Cole


of course cole is the play but wheeler will probably cost significantly less than cole...that's just reality

regarding carlson...most top prospects are getting the jump from AA to the majors this day in age. I was figuring that into my thought process

Anyway, didn't mean to derail the flaherty thread, but it kinda ties into a Flaherty lead staff.


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PostPosted: August 9 19, 10:41 am 
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go birds wrote:
cardsfantx wrote:
sorry, don't understand the wheeler talk when Cole is a FA

if we don't even attempt Cole (like we didn't with Scherzer) then i got issues

I don't want to hear crap about the payroll; they put themselves in this spot with stupid decisions like the unnecessary carpenter extension...that's nearly 19 million you could've put towards Cole


of course cole is the play but wheeler will probably cost significantly less than cole...that's just reality

regarding carlson...most top prospects are getting the jump from AA to the majors this day in age. I was figuring that into my thought process

Anyway, didn't mean to derail the flaherty thread, but it kinda ties into a Flaherty lead staff.


Allow me bring even more reality; Cards say they want Cole, and dedicate a big effort towards wooing him. They don't even consider Wheeler an alternative, because he's "not ace material". Then they get outbid by Boston, and miss on Wheeler because they never made diligence calls.


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PostPosted: August 9 19, 11:06 am 
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Cole is also going to be in his 30's for the length of his deal. Sure, he's great and could remain great, but that is not the direction the Cards are likely to go unless the market collapses. That seems unlikely for a 29 year old. At the same time, his age 31-34 seasons could be rough.

IMO, the Cards are already too old in their core. Wheeler, Cole, Rendon are not the kinds of moves this club should make, especially if we then run an OF of Bader, O'Neill and Fowler. We're looking at 80'ish wins again, and real trouble coming in 2-3 years.

I'm not there yet, but I'm pretty close to advocating going into next season with the exact team we have right now, minus our FA's, with many a minor addition or to that will take innings or matchup pressure off the younger kids. Rendon, Cole, Wheeler will not define our future. It's Flaherty, O'Neill, Bader, Carlson, Gorman, DeJong, and others. Might as well let them all play, take the one year hit in the standings (if there is one), and create financial space and system depth to make a serious run in 2 years, assuming that those players work out OK.


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PostPosted: August 9 19, 11:12 am 
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Agree with Fat. Can't keep getting older.

We needed and should have been going hard on international signings a la Dodgers and Yankees to stay competitive as the core ages.

Doesn't hurt to find journeyman gems like Muncy/Turner too. Is Mo capable of spotting such talents?

w/r/t Flaherty. He is going to rock this league.


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PostPosted: August 9 19, 11:16 am 
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Big Amoco Sign wrote:
Agree with Fat. Can't keep getting older.

We needed and should have been going hard on international signings a la Dodgers and Yankees to stay competitive as the core ages.



yea i agree...but after the luis robert debacle and losing out on Maitan, i don't see them going this route.

sure maitan is breaching big time bust territory, but it's a blue chip prospect they were in on and failed to sign.

we should probably break this off and move to a different thread as its worth discussing


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PostPosted: August 10 19, 8:20 am 
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Trade Martinez and Wong for prospects and salary relief, use Edman and Munoz at 2B, and sign Cole. Payroll goes up by $10-12 million maybe and the rotation gets far better without creating that much issue in the lineup.

This has almost no chance of happening but I'd be on favor of it.


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PostPosted: August 10 19, 11:38 am 
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PA_Hiker wrote:
Trade Martinez and Wong for prospects and salary relief, use Edman and Munoz at 2B, and sign Cole. Payroll goes up by $10-12 million maybe and the rotation gets far better without creating that much issue in the lineup.

This has almost no chance of happening but I'd be on favor of it.

Or just sign Cole and keep the other two good players (Martinez and Wong)


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PostPosted: August 10 19, 11:40 am 
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InvincibleCakeEater wrote:
PA_Hiker wrote:
Trade Martinez and Wong for prospects and salary relief, use Edman and Munoz at 2B, and sign Cole. Payroll goes up by $10-12 million maybe and the rotation gets far better without creating that much issue in the lineup.

This has almost no chance of happening but I'd be on favor of it.

Or just sign Cole and keep the other two good players (Martinez and Wong)


Yea, let’s not make every day players of those two.


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PostPosted: August 10 19, 12:09 pm 
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InvincibleCakeEater wrote:
PA_Hiker wrote:
Trade Martinez and Wong for prospects and salary relief, use Edman and Munoz at 2B, and sign Cole. Payroll goes up by $10-12 million maybe and the rotation gets far better without creating that much issue in the lineup.

This has almost no chance of happening but I'd be on favor of it.

Or just sign Cole and keep the other two good players (Martinez and Wong)

Payroll would then be pushing close to the luxury tax limit, so I'm not sure I could see it being viable for ownership. In a perfect world, sure. I'd go for that.


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