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PostPosted: November 15 18, 2:39 pm 
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Quote:
TomBruno23
2:27
As a Cardinal fan, I feel that is a list of kids only a parent could love. Led off by a guy who has pitched one game in two years, a hitter who wears catching equipment, the future joey Gallo, a guy whose best tools are age and switch-hitting, Dakota Hudson, a complex teenage OF, a scaled down Miguel Sano (who you know I’m excited about), an injured pitcher, a defensive utility IF, the future Luke Gregerson, and Wheels Garcia. I do think Andy Young will be a good utility player, I’m now remembering my dream last night that Pham beat Fowler out for RF and now realizing he was dealt for the #15 and #19 guys on this list. How should I feel about the future?

Eric A Longenhagen
2:27
I think the future is bleak for all of us


Quote:
nb
3:02
Hey Eric - I was interested in something from your Cardinals rankings. You said that the Cards just started scouting the backfields. I don't get why teams don't do this, especially in AZ where the complexes are so close together. Seems like teams are missing out on a potential goldmine. Why?

Eric A Longenhagen
3:02
Ownership is cheap


Quote:
Scaramouche!
3:11
The Cardinals prospect list is great! thanks for that. If Carson Kelly were still a prospect, would you rank him above Kinzer?

Eric A Longenhagen
3:11
Nope
But he'd be a 50


Quote:
STL Dave
3:19
I was very surprised at the appearance of RF Jhon Torres at 6th on the Cardinals top 40 prospects after assuming he was a throw-in in the Oscar Mercado trade. Did Cleveland get fleeced?

Eric A Longenhagen
3:19
Nah, I just think 'throw in' gets assigned to rookie-level prospects too often.

ericmlord
3:20
Is Carson Kelly not still a prospect? Rookie status is still intact though this offseason.

Eric A Longenhagen
3:21
Exceeded to 45-day non-September roster days rule


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PostPosted: November 15 18, 11:59 pm 
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They did a good job on the list. Those two are notorious for being conservative on players, so it doesn't surprise me they are very low on the Nunez/Herrera types. I think they're underselling them because they are a bit advanced physically for their ages, but that's what they do. They regress their tools grades way too far in my experience.

It also shows you how good Jhon Torres looked for them to have him that high being that far from the major leagues. My order would be quite different, and I disagree with their tools rankings quite a bit, but they've got the structure/gist of things in a way that makes sense.

Dylan Carlson is a guy who is slowly working his way into a legit star prospect. It'll be all about turning that power projection into reality at AA, where slugging percentages go to soar.


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PostPosted: November 16 18, 8:30 am 
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-go birds
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phins wrote:
They did a good job on the list. Those two are notorious for being conservative on players, so it doesn't surprise me they are very low on the Nunez/Herrera types. I think they're underselling them because they are a bit advanced physically for their ages, but that's what they do. They regress their tools grades way too far in my experience.

It also shows you how good Jhon Torres looked for them to have him that high being that far from the major leagues. My order would be quite different, and I disagree with their tools rankings quite a bit, but they've got the structure/gist of things in a way that makes sense.

Dylan Carlson is a guy who is slowly working his way into a legit star prospect. It'll be all about turning that power projection into reality at AA, where slugging percentages go to soar.


does carlson ultimately settle in at 1B or could he stick in RF, in your opinion?


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PostPosted: November 16 18, 8:59 am 
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Carlson had 11 assists this year and 14 last year, so he clearly has the arm for RF. Unless he becomes a complete lumbering slowpoke you'd have to think he stays there.

Also, FG rated Bader a 45 fielder (w/60 speed and 55 arm) coming into this year. Dejong was a 40 at 3rd according to their scouting. I don't trust their view on Montero any more than what they missed with Bader and Dejong. I think it's at least as likely, if not more, that Gorman is the long term 1B.

I'll just leave this here to close...



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PostPosted: November 16 18, 9:05 am 
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-go birds
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good stuff


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PostPosted: November 16 18, 12:19 pm 
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go birds wrote:
phins wrote:
They did a good job on the list. Those two are notorious for being conservative on players, so it doesn't surprise me they are very low on the Nunez/Herrera types. I think they're underselling them because they are a bit advanced physically for their ages, but that's what they do. They regress their tools grades way too far in my experience.

It also shows you how good Jhon Torres looked for them to have him that high being that far from the major leagues. My order would be quite different, and I disagree with their tools rankings quite a bit, but they've got the structure/gist of things in a way that makes sense.

Dylan Carlson is a guy who is slowly working his way into a legit star prospect. It'll be all about turning that power projection into reality at AA, where slugging percentages go to soar.


does carlson ultimately settle in at 1B or could he stick in RF, in your opinion?


Carlson is known to not just be a plus makeup guy, but a plus/plus makeup guy. For that reason, I have almost zero doubt he will stick in either RF or at least LF. He played some CF before last year. It's pretty rare to go from a guy competent in CF to a 1B-only player. He's a pretty neutral defensive player in the only real minor league defensive advanced metrics available to the public.

http://www.claydavenport.com/ht/CARLSON19981023A.shtml


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PostPosted: November 16 18, 12:22 pm 
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PA_Hiker wrote:
I don't trust their view on Montero any more than what they missed with Bader and Dejong. I think it's at least as likely, if not more, that Gorman is the long term 1B.



I'd honestly flip them and say Montero probably ends up a 1B and Gorman sticks at 3B, but the point is to have as many bullets as possible aimed at the middle-of-the-order corner bats that we've been missing for some time. It'd be great if one of them could be a plus defender at one of the positions, but it's looking likely that they'll end up merely competent.

Luken Baker and several others are in that "major bat" category.


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PostPosted: November 16 18, 12:25 pm 
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Clay Davenport's metrics had Gorman as a great defender at rookie-level and slightly above-average at A-ball, which is pretty great for a player his age to be above average of much older peers.

Montero has pretty consistently been well below-average as a 3B according to his metrics and has a frame that looks like it's going to carry more mass moving forward than Gorman as well.


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PostPosted: December 10 18, 8:46 am 
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Location: No. 16 on the Cards Top 15 Prospect List
phins wrote:
Clay Davenport's metrics had Gorman as a great defender at rookie-level and slightly above-average at A-ball, which is pretty great for a player his age to be above average of much older peers.

Montero has pretty consistently been well below-average as a 3B according to his metrics and has a frame that looks like it's going to carry more mass moving forward than Gorman as well.


Good to see some stats that sort of show what many were thinking. I would love to be able to hope that Montero could stick at 3rd and be pretty certain that Gorman will.

I still haven’t seen anything to indicate that Gorman is likely to be moved off the position as he progressss, barring some kind of injury or an unexpected weight issue.

Lots of reasons to be excited about the lower half of the system.


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