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PostPosted: February 15 17, 5:02 pm 
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Michael wrote:
wart57 wrote:
Michael wrote:
wart57 wrote:
But what would be the harm in doing a real, in depth scientific study to make sure all of the vaccines are safe. To get some real statistics to combat the off the wall claims that the anti-vaxers are spewing?


The research and statistics already exist. Tons of it. I recommend watching frontline doc for more info: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/film/vaccines/


Any chance that a government study - a real unbiased one would be more accepted by some of these anti-vax nut jobs? I have tried to explain to them over and over, given actual numbers and stats, and still get the same response - "Autism has gone up since vaxing has gone up."


No, because real unbiased government and university studies from all over the world exist that find no link between vaccines and autism yet the crazies keep going. I recommend watching the frontline documentary. It's infuriating. I'd also pass it along to anyone who is unsure on this issue. If they watch it and they still aren't convinced they are lost cause and there is no saving them.

The fact that the leader of the free world is dumb enough to give this any credence is frightening.


Very frightening indeed. But, I don't think he is doing it because he believes it, I think he does it because he knows how much these anti-vaxers will love him if he spouts off about it, and it will piss off the people who already don't like him.


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PostPosted: February 15 17, 5:18 pm 
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wart57 wrote:
But, I don't think he is doing it because he believes it, I think he does it because he knows how much these anti-vaxers will love him if he spouts off about it, and it will piss off the people who already don't like him.


He's been tweeting about it for years and has obviously made this a priority for his administration. There's no reason to think he doesn't believe it.


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PostPosted: February 15 17, 5:22 pm 
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cardsfansince82 wrote:
wart57 wrote:
But, I don't think he is doing it because he believes it, I think he does it because he knows how much these anti-vaxers will love him if he spouts off about it, and it will piss off the people who already don't like him.


He's been tweeting about it for years and has obviously made this a priority for his administration. There's no reason to think he doesn't believe it.


I take everything he says with a grain of salt. His ulterior motives have ulterior motives.


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PostPosted: February 15 17, 5:31 pm 
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No he really believes this [expletive].

anti-vaxers tend to be on the left and I doubt they voted for him so what you're saying doesn't add up.


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PostPosted: February 15 17, 5:33 pm 
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wart57 wrote:
Simple question. I am a believer in vaccines. I have had my kids vaccinated. I have gone off on several of my wife's cousins who are thinking about not vaccinating their kids. I think not vaccinating your kids is barbaric and very dangerous to not only your kids, but the public at large. But what would be the harm in doing a real, in depth scientific study to make sure all of the vaccines are safe. To get some real statistics to combat the off the wall claims that the anti-vaxers are spewing?

Ummm it has been done.

These people hate science. Another study changes nothing.


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PostPosted: February 15 17, 5:36 pm 
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It adds up to me. Trump targetted every single-issue voter that he could during the election. Even courting standing on seemingly opposite sides of some issues (like being anti-Iraq war while being pro-defense spending).

I'm also not certain that anti-vax people are decidedly in the left wing ledger. You have a lot of libertarians and Orange County (a historically Republican area, but I believe finally went blue this year) types.


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PostPosted: February 15 17, 5:49 pm 
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wart57 wrote:
I take everything he says with a grain of salt. His ulterior motives have ulterior motives.


Almost every thing he said during the campaign he has followed up on in some way. He's exactly as awful as he said he would be so I'm not sure why the grain of salt is needed.

Popeye_Card wrote:
It adds up to me. Trump targetted every single-issue voter that he could during the election. Even courting standing on seemingly opposite sides of some issues (like being anti-Iraq war while being pro-defense spending).

I'm also not certain that anti-vax people are decidedly in the left wing ledger. You have a lot of libertarians and Orange County (a historically Republican area, but I believe finally went blue this year) types.


The election is over. No one has ever even run on an anti vax platform, but even if there are single issue voters for that he doesn't have to appease them. Certainly not to the tune of multiple meetings to establish a commission in the first month of his presidency.


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PostPosted: February 15 17, 5:57 pm 
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cardsfansince82 wrote:
wart57 wrote:
I take everything he says with a grain of salt. His ulterior motives have ulterior motives.


Almost every thing he said during the campaign he has followed up on in some way. He's exactly as awful as he said he would be so I'm not sure why the grain of salt is needed.

Popeye_Card wrote:
It adds up to me. Trump targetted every single-issue voter that he could during the election. Even courting standing on seemingly opposite sides of some issues (like being anti-Iraq war while being pro-defense spending).

I'm also not certain that anti-vax people are decidedly in the left wing ledger. You have a lot of libertarians and Orange County (a historically Republican area, but I believe finally went blue this year) types.


The election is over. No one has ever even run on an anti vax platform, but even if there are single issue voters for that he doesn't have to appease them. Certainly not to the tune of multiple meetings to establish a commission in the first month of his presidency.


All of this is a big game to him. He is like a child, he will push as far as he can to see where the boundaries are. I hate the anti-vaxer crap out there, and if he truly believes there is a connection, there is another reason I don't like the man.


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PostPosted: February 15 17, 10:49 pm 
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This is the same as investigating "voter fraud".

Love that small government


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PostPosted: February 16 17, 10:05 am 
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Just a couple things that I hope people keep in mind.

1. Scientific findings suggest vaccines to be safe.
2. Science is constantly changing.
3. Most people are doing what they believe is best for their children.

I've said this before, but it's worth repeating. It's inarguable that scientific findings point to the efficacy and safety of vaccines. It's impossible to disprove everything the anti-vax crowd alleges as it's a shifting goalpost and doing studies endangers lives. So, the best scientific data course at the moment is to vaccinate children.

There's no guarantee in 200 years or whatever that this won't change and it's almost a guarantee that vaccines themselves will change over the course of time as they can be improved. In other words, they're not perfect.

We vaccinate our kids because it's probably the right thing to do. But, I think people need to lay off the holier than thou attitude that just because it is scientifically likely the correct thing to do that nothing bad can happen and alternate hypotheses are [expletive] stoopid1!

This applies to everything in general. Until something becomes a scientific law, it's not absolute and is subject to change. Yes, we should use science to better humanity and unfortunately there is a large group of people that just flat out ignores science. But just because science suggests something does not mean it's an absolute certainty beyond reproach and people that question it are stupid.

All that said, vaccinate your damn kids, [blue]you dumb asses[/blue]


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