GatewayRedbirds.com

A Message Board Dedicated to Discussing St. Louis Cardinals Baseball!
It is currently August 26 19, 12:51 am

All times are UTC - 6 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 49 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Antifa
PostPosted: August 15 17, 10:46 pm 
Offline
http://tinyurl.com/2e4x5hy

Joined: April 15 06, 6:25 pm
Posts: 24834
Location: St. Louis
Can someone help inform me on this "group"? Especially as it relates to violent incidents? Of course everyone defending Trump brings up this group. I just want to be informed before I dismiss them.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Antifa
PostPosted: August 16 17, 1:20 am 
Offline
Don't tone police me bro!
User avatar

Joined: July 1 06, 7:24 pm
Posts: 10475
Location: Lost in the Cloud
AFAIK less of a 'group' and more of an attitude. Why is your inclination to dismiss anti-fascism?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Antifa
PostPosted: August 16 17, 2:36 am 
Offline
Perennial All-Star

Joined: June 15 06, 6:11 am
Posts: 4792
Location: Minneapolis
During tonight's bout with insomnia, I was asking myself this same question. I found this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antifa_(United_States)

Seems to me like they are essentially the opposite of Neo-nazi/KKK groups except they will also resort to violence and/or property destruction. According to that wikipedia page, they also have some anarchy and anti-capitalism tendencies, which I have some issues with. I also have issues with the violence and property destruction.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Antifa
PostPosted: August 16 17, 6:58 am 
Offline
is shooing asian children away from his fridge.
User avatar

Joined: May 17 06, 10:23 pm
Posts: 27872
Location: at the gettin' place
Schlich wrote:
AFAIK less of a 'group' and more of an attitude. Why is your inclination to dismiss anti-fascism?


The inclination is dismiss the argument from Trumpers. "We're trying to be fascists and these people won't let us!"


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Antifa
PostPosted: August 16 17, 7:15 am 
Offline
Hall Of Famer
User avatar

Joined: July 15 08, 8:24 pm
Posts: 19614
Location: Low A Minors
Not all of the people being called "antifa" in the wake of Charlottesville are really "antifa". I have seen the woman who got killed referred to as "antifa" numerous times, and she really wasn't. She was just a protester. Same with all the people injured in that incident.

A group called Redneck Rebellion was there and they provided "security" to a lot of the counterprotesters, and also to a church threatened by Nazis. They were there to deter violence, not to start it. I think they were involved in some shoving and other altercations, but they were just keeping Nazis back from the counterprotesters.

This article was pretty good (linked to from Wikipedia).
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/04/educ ... .html?_r=0
Quote:
The Antifa didn’t protest at the April 27 rally supporting Ann Coulter, whose talk was canceled for that day by a university fearful of violence. “Someone like Coulter, she’s pretty much nothing to us,” Dan explained. “There’s a different level of threat here. Milo Yiannopoulos, he’s at the vanguard of a new right movement that’s much more dangerous than the conservative establishment.” Yiannopoulos supporters, he said, had displayed anti-Semitic posters and Nazi salutes at the free speech rallies.

Dan said he supports the right of conservatives to speak on campus, but fascism must be stopped — by violence, if necessary. “We’ve seen in history that the very fact that we allow certain people to talk normalizes their speech, and there’s the possibility of their narrative being accepted and even being widespread in the society.”


And here is a fascist campus organizer:
Quote:
“The reality is that the narrative regarding race and identity and diversity today is the way it is because of the activism of left-wing groups. Our countering narrative on it, like Milo Yiannopoulos, Christina Hoff Sommers, Jordan Peterson, they’re getting shut down. So I said, there is a superior strategy to coordinated action, and that’s something we have to replicate.”

When school resumes, Mr. Damigo plans to “step it up” by setting up tables on campuses with Identity Evropa T-shirts and banners. And at U.C. Berkeley? Mr. Damigo laughed. “We’ve got some plans.”


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Antifa
PostPosted: August 16 17, 7:16 am 
Offline
bronoun enthusiast
User avatar

Joined: April 14 06, 10:45 pm
Posts: 28385
Location: extremely online
Antifa and Anti-Racist Action are not specifically punk rock, but evolved from the hardcore punk scene in the 80's. Neo-nazi skinheads show up to a show, beat people up, and anti-racist, anti-bigotry punks loosely organized to beat the [expletive] out of nazis and keep them from crashing the shows before the nazis could beat the [expletive] out of everyone else. It's evolved from the leftist and inclusive politics of that side of the hardcore scene (the non jock/skinhead side).

Spoiler: show


Like schlich said, it's not super organized, unlike the far right, but in any "scene" where violent racism/fascism is a problem, antifa will have to be more organized and more commensurately violent. In any protest, whether it be right, left, or both, every individual has their own capacity for violence and mob mentality will contribute to that a great deal.

Criticizing or targeting antifa as a hate group from the center-right or left is a little misguided because, inherently violent individuals that you will find in any group aside, it's a response to hate and violence. It's there to defend, and it's hard not to justify it when you see [expletive] like this:

Spoiler: show
Image


Or for example, cars plowing into peaceful protesters. I personally have never gone to a political event with any intention of engaging in violence, and I believe in the idea of non-violence, but I just know that's not totally possible, especially in the face of right-wing violence and intimidation. Also, it's pretty effective. People who wish to put fear into the hearts of other people should be made to fear the consequences when they do. If you can't trust the government and police to do that, you take it into your own hands. It's always down to each individual to do what they think is right and in the height of the very real battle lines that are drawn in situations like Charlottesville, sometimes I bet it feels right to stomp on a white supremacist's head. All of that said, much of the antifa criticism is a false equivocation from the right to try to convince the average, non-politically engaged American that there is an equivalent relationship to violence and anarchy on both sides when there just. plain. isn't.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Antifa
PostPosted: August 20 17, 10:29 am 
Offline
Consider him admonished
User avatar

Joined: March 25 15, 9:59 am
Posts: 8262
Location: Charleston, SC via Arkansas
There was a guy on Meet The Press today who wrote the Antifa Handbook. He's definitely against free speech and said peaceful protests don't work. I'd say Boston yesterday show'd otherwise


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Antifa
PostPosted: August 20 17, 10:31 am 
Offline
Consider him admonished
User avatar

Joined: March 25 15, 9:59 am
Posts: 8262
Location: Charleston, SC via Arkansas
http://www.nbcnews.com/meet-the-press/v ... 8526659570


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Antifa
PostPosted: August 28 17, 11:44 am 
Offline
Hall Of Famer
User avatar

Joined: October 12 06, 2:21 pm
Posts: 16712
Location: Baseball Ref Bullpen
These guys can go to hell. We don't need radicalization on the left to justify the fascist radicals on the right that are in charge. We need good courageous people willing to stand up and expose the brutality and injustice for what it is.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/08/28/black-clad-antifa-attack-right-wing-demonstrators-in-berkeley

If it turns out the 13 'antifa' arrested were 'fa' trying to stir up trouble, my apologies. But I bet not.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Antifa
PostPosted: August 28 17, 12:02 pm 
Offline
a bad penny always turns up
User avatar

Joined: April 17 06, 12:27 pm
Posts: 23436
Location: Hanging out with my redneck, white socks and Blue Ribbon beer.
Well good. I must not be a Trump defender, because until a few days ago I never heard of Antifa, and still have no idea what it is.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 49 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

All times are UTC - 6 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 11 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group