GatewayRedbirds.com

A Message Board Dedicated to Discussing St. Louis Cardinals Baseball!
It is currently December 6 19, 6:32 am

All times are UTC - 6 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 211 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: September 20 17, 3:18 pm 
Offline
Sucking on the Rally Nipple
User avatar

Joined: April 16 06, 6:03 pm
Posts: 21695
Location: Chicago
wart57 wrote:
cardsfansince82 wrote:
I'm pretty sure no one called it the "war of northern aggression" during the war. That's straight out of the post war lost cause revisionist history.

You are correct - it was used after the war, in most cases long after the war so the non racist people of the South could falsely find reasons to honor those who died in the war. The racist folks didn't care what it was called, and the closet racists embraced this term to try to cover their racism.

Make no mistake the Civil War was about slavery, it is noted in the all the States articles of Secession.

National or regional pride is a funny thing, atrocities will be washed over to make people feel better about themselves.

Not every confederate soldier who fought or died was racist. Most of them probably were - a product of their time.

Nuances are tough, it is just easier to say they were all racist and walk away.

There are a lot of Revisionists who are trying to defend Lee, saying he wasn't racist, but if you read some of his writing, he quite clearly believes blacks are inferior to whites. The removal of statues of him should continue.

What I am trying to say - badly it seems - is the many of the people who fought and died for the Confederacy were sold a bill of goods by the rich slave owners and the State government - some probably believed in slavery and were fighting for it, while some believed they were fighting to protect the agrarian lifestyle of the south against the "evil industrialists of the North" - a bill of goods.

Anybody in the south who still believes this has been sold a bill of goods as well and they need to do the research and realize the South was Wrong, and do something today to get rid of any of the remaining glorification the Confederacy.


I hear ya wart. And to be clear, I'm not trying to say that you are saying that the Civil War wasn't about slavery. I know you're not saying that. No doubt, many of the soldiers fighting for the Confederacy were not jihadis for slavery. I'm sure most of them considered blacks inferior to whites and thus deserving of being enslaved, but that was the prevailing attitude at the time. They fought because there was a war in their front yard. What were they supposed to do, defect and fight for the Union?

So all the more reason not to venerate the leaders of the Confederacy in statue form. Put up statues to the common soldier if we want to celebrate the little guy. Why are we honoring the ring leaders who sent regular folk off to their deaths to preserve a monstrosity just because it made them rich? Is the the "heritage" that southerners want to be celebrating?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: September 20 17, 3:27 pm 
Offline
just can't quit you.
User avatar

Joined: April 18 06, 4:33 pm
Posts: 24841
Location: Lost
G. Keenan wrote:
wart57 wrote:
cardsfansince82 wrote:
I'm pretty sure no one called it the "war of northern aggression" during the war. That's straight out of the post war lost cause revisionist history.

You are correct - it was used after the war, in most cases long after the war so the non racist people of the South could falsely find reasons to honor those who died in the war. The racist folks didn't care what it was called, and the closet racists embraced this term to try to cover their racism.

Make no mistake the Civil War was about slavery, it is noted in the all the States articles of Secession.

National or regional pride is a funny thing, atrocities will be washed over to make people feel better about themselves.

Not every confederate soldier who fought or died was racist. Most of them probably were - a product of their time.

Nuances are tough, it is just easier to say they were all racist and walk away.

There are a lot of Revisionists who are trying to defend Lee, saying he wasn't racist, but if you read some of his writing, he quite clearly believes blacks are inferior to whites. The removal of statues of him should continue.

What I am trying to say - badly it seems - is the many of the people who fought and died for the Confederacy were sold a bill of goods by the rich slave owners and the State government - some probably believed in slavery and were fighting for it, while some believed they were fighting to protect the agrarian lifestyle of the south against the "evil industrialists of the North" - a bill of goods.

Anybody in the south who still believes this has been sold a bill of goods as well and they need to do the research and realize the South was Wrong, and do something today to get rid of any of the remaining glorification the Confederacy.


I hear ya wart. And to be clear, I'm not trying to say that you are saying that the Civil War wasn't about slavery. I know you're not saying that. No doubt, many of the soldiers fighting for the Confederacy were not jihadis for slavery. I'm sure most of them considered blacks inferior to whites and thus deserving of being enslaved, but that was the prevailing attitude at the time. They fought because there was a war in their front yard. What were they supposed to do, defect and fight for the Union?

So all the more reason not to venerate the leaders of the Confederacy in statue form. Put up statues to the common soldier if we want to celebrate the little guy. Why are we honoring the ring leaders who sent regular folk off to their deaths to preserve a monstrosity just because it made them rich? Is the the "heritage" that southerners want to be celebrating?


I hated all the "South Will Rise again" crap when I lived in Alabama back in the late 90's. The South Lost the War. It was fighting for the right to keep people as property, all other reasons were made up to so some of the people fighting for it had something other than an atrocity to fight for.

Any Glorification of the Confederate leadership is wrong, in my opinion.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: October 26 17, 8:25 am 
Offline
'Burb Boy
User avatar

Joined: July 9 06, 11:33 am
Posts: 19674
Location: Out of the Loop
He’s back on his statues [expletive].



Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: October 26 17, 10:37 am 
Offline
Seeking a Zubaz seamstress

Joined: September 4 07, 1:48 pm
Posts: 24872
Location: St. Louis
MrCrowesGarden wrote:
He’s back on his statues [expletive].


The unabashed racists of the GOP


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: October 26 17, 12:57 pm 
Offline
Hall Of Famer
User avatar

Joined: October 12 06, 2:21 pm
Posts: 17181
Location: Baseball Ref Bullpen
Freed Roger wrote:
MrCrowesGarden wrote:
He’s back on his statues [expletive].


The unabashed racists of the GOP

Hey, if it ain't broke, why fix it?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: October 27 17, 9:37 am 
Offline
Perennial All-Star
User avatar

Joined: April 20 06, 8:43 pm
Posts: 8713
Location: Please use blue font for the sarcasm impaired.
I live in an area (eastern Franklin County) that is somewhat rural and somewhat suburban. It is largely white, and very red. I'm sure Trump won my county, probably 80/20 if I had to guess.

In my subdivision, there's this guy who I used to be friends with on Facebook. I had to unfriend him after he said he was "locked and loaded" and ready to go to war to protect statues in our area. I mean, this guy is off the deep end Info Wars crazy.

Anyway, this morning on my way out of my subdivision, this guy's house has a flagpole taller than all our houses with both the US and confederate flags on them. He's former military and I just can't fathom how he thinks it's acceptable in any way to fly these two flags together. It literally does not compute.

Edit: This is the comment that I unfriended him for:
Spoiler: show
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: October 29 17, 11:28 am 
Offline
Hall Of Famer
User avatar

Joined: April 18 06, 9:40 pm
Posts: 24689
GeddyWrox wrote:
I live in an area (eastern Franklin County) that is somewhat rural and somewhat suburban. It is largely white, and very red. I'm sure Trump won my county, probably 80/20 if I had to guess.

In my subdivision, there's this guy who I used to be friends with on Facebook. I had to unfriend him after he said he was "locked and loaded" and ready to go to war to protect statues in our area. I mean, this guy is off the deep end Info Wars crazy.

Anyway, this morning on my way out of my subdivision, this guy's house has a flagpole taller than all our houses with both the US and confederate flags on them. He's former military and I just can't fathom how he thinks it's acceptable in any way to fly these two flags together. It literally does not compute.

Edit: This is the comment that I unfriended him for:
Spoiler: show
Image


Was that directed at you?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: October 29 17, 12:10 pm 
Offline
Has an anecdote about a townie he overheard.
User avatar

Joined: December 6 10, 1:09 am
Posts: 11582
Location: Illinois
GeddyWrox wrote:
I live in an area (eastern Franklin County) that is somewhat rural and somewhat suburban. It is largely white, and very red. I'm sure Trump won my county, probably 80/20 if I had to guess.

In my subdivision, there's this guy who I used to be friends with on Facebook. I had to unfriend him after he said he was "locked and loaded" and ready to go to war to protect statues in our area. I mean, this guy is off the deep end Info Wars crazy.

Anyway, this morning on my way out of my subdivision, this guy's house has a flagpole taller than all our houses with both the US and confederate flags on them. He's former military and I just can't fathom how he thinks it's acceptable in any way to fly these two flags together. It literally does not compute.

Edit: This is the comment that I unfriended him for:
Spoiler: show
Image


Why isn't this guy in jail for making terrorists threats? If he was Muslim he would be.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: October 29 17, 1:38 pm 
Offline
Perennial All-Star
User avatar

Joined: April 20 06, 8:43 pm
Posts: 8713
Location: Please use blue font for the sarcasm impaired.
ghostrunner wrote:
GeddyWrox wrote:
I live in an area (eastern Franklin County) that is somewhat rural and somewhat suburban. It is largely white, and very red. I'm sure Trump won my county, probably 80/20 if I had to guess.

In my subdivision, there's this guy who I used to be friends with on Facebook. I had to unfriend him after he said he was "locked and loaded" and ready to go to war to protect statues in our area. I mean, this guy is off the deep end Info Wars crazy.

Anyway, this morning on my way out of my subdivision, this guy's house has a flagpole taller than all our houses with both the US and confederate flags on them. He's former military and I just can't fathom how he thinks it's acceptable in any way to fly these two flags together. It literally does not compute.

Edit: This is the comment that I unfriended him for:
Spoiler: show
Image


Was that directed at you?

Yes, the red part is my first and last name, and it was posted as a comment on a post on my wall about the statues.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: October 29 17, 1:40 pm 
Offline
Perennial All-Star
User avatar

Joined: April 20 06, 8:43 pm
Posts: 8713
Location: Please use blue font for the sarcasm impaired.
IMADreamer wrote:
GeddyWrox wrote:
I live in an area (eastern Franklin County) that is somewhat rural and somewhat suburban. It is largely white, and very red. I'm sure Trump won my county, probably 80/20 if I had to guess.

In my subdivision, there's this guy who I used to be friends with on Facebook. I had to unfriend him after he said he was "locked and loaded" and ready to go to war to protect statues in our area. I mean, this guy is off the deep end Info Wars crazy.

Anyway, this morning on my way out of my subdivision, this guy's house has a flagpole taller than all our houses with both the US and confederate flags on them. He's former military and I just can't fathom how he thinks it's acceptable in any way to fly these two flags together. It literally does not compute.

Edit: This is the comment that I unfriended him for:
Spoiler: show
Image


Why isn't this guy in jail for making terrorists threats? If he was Muslim he would be.

I didn't report him. Out here it would've just gotten a shrug. Or worse, I would've been put on some sort of "liberal POS" list.

Edit: I *did* report it to Facebook though.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 211 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22  Next

All times are UTC - 6 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 12 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group