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 Post subject: Re: Tax Reform
PostPosted: November 26 18, 4:04 pm 
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Michael wrote:
Buick exists because they are popular in China otherwise the brand would be dead.


I remember a few years ago Buick had a car parked in front of my apartment for two weeks. If you sat in the car and took a survey you would get a free box of chocolates from the chocolate shop next door.

I sat in the Buick and took the survey. It had a very nice interior. I asked how much it cost and it was something like $45k. I was like lol yeah not the car for me thanks. People spend that kind of money on Buicks? I had no idea.


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 Post subject: Re: Tax Reform
PostPosted: November 26 18, 5:10 pm 
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It is insane how much vehicles cost now. The F150 is the best selling vehicle in the US. They start at $28,000. Add a couple of decent options and you're looking at $40k.


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 Post subject: Re: Tax Reform
PostPosted: November 26 18, 5:20 pm 
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Popeye_Card wrote:
It is insane how much vehicles cost now. The F150 is the best selling vehicle in the US. They start at $28,000. Add a couple of decent options and you're looking at $40k.

plus it seems like dealerships, and consumers, have no problems with these like...72 and 84 month payment plans, suckling away for years


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 Post subject: Re: Tax Reform
PostPosted: November 26 18, 5:35 pm 
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Jocephus wrote:
Popeye_Card wrote:
It is insane how much vehicles cost now. The F150 is the best selling vehicle in the US. They start at $28,000. Add a couple of decent options and you're looking at $40k.

plus it seems like dealerships, and consumers, have no problems with these like...72 and 84 month payment plans, suckling away for years


You can go up to 96 months now. You can also go to a GM lot and find vehicles over $100,000. Someone posted a 1970 vehicle ad on Facebook the other day and a new f150 was $2155. Adjusting for inflation that’s $15,000, but they start at twice that now.


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 Post subject: Re: Tax Reform
PostPosted: November 26 18, 9:02 pm 
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Popeye_Card wrote:
Show of hands--who here drives a newer GM car or has even heavily considered buying one in the past several years?

Since my dad's purchase of a brand new 1978 Dodge Volare station wagon that dropped its drive shaft the day after we purchased it - not one American car between him or me. That thing ripped a hole in our driveway asphalt too.

I drove one American hand-me-down my first year in college but never bought one. Evar.


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 Post subject: Re: Tax Reform
PostPosted: November 29 18, 5:55 am 
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Diddy wrote:
Jocephus wrote:
Popeye_Card wrote:
It is insane how much vehicles cost now. The F150 is the best selling vehicle in the US. They start at $28,000. Add a couple of decent options and you're looking at $40k.

plus it seems like dealerships, and consumers, have no problems with these like...72 and 84 month payment plans, suckling away for years


You can go up to 96 months now. You can also go to a GM lot and find vehicles over $100,000. Someone posted a 1970 vehicle ad on Facebook the other day and a new f150 was $2155. Adjusting for inflation that’s $15,000, but they start at twice that now.

Jesus. Perfectly happy with my $17,000 Sonata and wife's $14,000 Elantra.


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 Post subject: Re: Tax Reform
PostPosted: November 29 18, 8:23 am 
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G. Keenan wrote:
tlombard wrote:
Just spitballing here and haven't put actual thought into this other than typing it out here.

Maybe the reason the right is so keen on lessening 'government intrusion' in our lives is because they are actively setting up a system where they don't need the government involved to maintain their power/greed by doing things like making it harder or near impossible to sue financial institutions when they blatantly screw people over. The wealthy elite don't need the government involved or to even be in government to profit and maintain their power when they are already in control of the institutions that are being given free reign to pillage from the working class and poor to begin with once the government protects them from any possible consequences with these new rulings/laws and deregulation.

I know that sounds a like something somebody who's into conspiracy theories and just a general nutcase would say but it is something that just popped into my head right now and not a fully formed thought and certainly not a belief.


It's not a conspiracy theory. It is a very accurate description of reality.

The hyper-wealthy have built and are trying to further entrench an economic system that puts them entirely beyond the reach of government, and since we live in a democracy, beyond the reach of their fellow citizens. As if we didn't already know, the leaks of the Paradise Papers and before them, the Panama Papers, reveal a vast ecosystem of tax havens, shell companies, and law firms that take huge sums of money and put it out of the reach of government taxing authorities. This means less money for schools, less money for healthcare, less money for roads, less money for public infrastructure, and on and on and on.

They very wealthy do not have to worry about the negative consequences of our fraying social order, our warming planet, our decaying educational system, decaying infrastructure, crazy expensive healthcare, etc.

For the rich, lobbying is an incredibly good investment. For only a few million dollars spent on lobbyists and campaign donations they reap billions of dollars in tax breaks.

Make no mistake. The rich are not your friend. The rich are, and always have been since before the Magna Carta, waging a war against you. This is an ancient feature of humanity. Yet we in the USA live in a state of permanent forgetting about how hard earned the legal and labor protections that made the middle class exist in the first place were. I mean, there used to be no such thing as a weekend. Think about that. Children used to work in factories. The entire economy of the the southern USA was built on the enslavement of human beings.

And still, everyday working people are tricked into giving billionaires yet more money for the promise of getting a $1500 tax cut. That's how desperate everyday people are in this country.





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 Post subject: Re: Tax Reform
PostPosted: November 29 18, 9:20 am 
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Popeye_Card wrote:
It is insane how much vehicles cost now. The F150 is the best selling vehicle in the US. They start at $28,000. Add a couple of decent options and you're looking at $40k.



You can option out an F150 to be over 100k. It's insane and at the end of the day it's still a Ford pick up truck which pales in comparison to the luxury you get on other $100k vehicles.

I genuinely don't know how people afford expensive cars, heck I'm not sure how a lot of people afford not expensive cars. The average person in my county makes $22000 a year, but I see 30k dollar cars and even more expensive trucks all over the place. It's nutty.


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 Post subject: Re: Tax Reform
PostPosted: November 29 18, 9:38 am 
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http://www.thenonprofittimes.com/news-articles/charitable-giving-gets-even-worse-in-second-quarter/

First two quarters 2018 showing charitable giving noticeably down. the # of donors has gottens less - which probably means small donors.
With Standard deduction for joint returns at 24,000 (nearly double what it was) the tax benefit of donating something has gone away for a lot of middle income taxpayers - especially since state local and property taxes aren't deductible past $10,000.

And this is before a large chunk of people fully realize their donations don't help their taxes anymore. Not going to crunch a bunch of stats on how and who this will affect - but I probably won't be able to itemize, like I've been for at least the last 20 years. My guesstimation is couples with mortgages under $275K will not be itemizing anymore.
If a couple has state and property taxes of at least $10k, and the interest portion of their mortgage of $12,000 per year ($240k x 5%) - only their donations over $2000 would help their taxes. Whatever, It is surely going to be a lot of people

What does this all mean? On the charity side, I think the smaller, more localized organizations depend on this middle income family giving. The high end donors and charities that rely on them will be unchanged - and you could see charities doubling down on pandering/wooing the lcoal Koch Bros or Sinquefields etc to sustain them - and not bothering as much with general population appeals.

I think people will still clean out their closets and take to Goodwill etc, but I think it will drop off some, with less urgency to get it there vs tossing it in the trash.

Again, most people aren't aware of this change. Once they are, then what happens to the psychology of giving for average people? Especially this time next year when the donation appeals come in.

On the plus side, some people will be more compelled to give to a cause that isn't a charity in the 501C tax deduction sense. A friend or someone you know that needs help. gofundme etc. We've been doing more of this the last few years.# I wish we were in a spot to do more. I like the directness of it.

On the down side of this plus side, there are a lot of people in need that we have no connection to. People that are able to have someone organize a gofundme or direct appeal typically are in their donor group's reach. A more organized charity is better to give to., to help people not in your social circle.

#we may or may not have snuck these off as tax deductions anyway.


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 Post subject: Re: Tax Reform
PostPosted: December 11 18, 2:54 pm 
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