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PostPosted: January 3 19, 4:25 pm 
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Fat Strat wrote:
I'm consistent in what I say I believe and how I act. Response: No, you're not, at least not according to psychology/sociology. Not any more than your average Christian. I don't know you personally, so don't take that as a personal shot. We're just not consistent beings. By your own measures of goodness and significance -- which are pretty admirable, thumbs up! -- you fail most of the time. You can always do more good. You often make choices not to do good because you decide someone doesn't deserve it. You'll focus on legacy one moment then focus on self-satisfaction the next. You might feel like you're pretty consistent, but you change by mood, environment, and company and the values through which you judge yourself and your actions change with it. Moral relativism vs. absolute truth. A Christian's hypocrisy is easier to see because you can point to a written standard and see where they don't line up. It's much harder to recognize our own inconsistencies when we don't have an external source to judge ourselves against.


Ah but then we get into a slippery slope. The "I could be doing more so I'm failing." If I give $1 to a beggar but I have $5 in my pocket, I've failed. If I give two hours of my time in a shelter plating turkey on Thanksgiving but then I enjoyed myself with my family for 2 more hours that I could have been plating more turkey, I failed. And so on. I don't subscribe to that. No one can subscribe to that. We'd never go to work. We'd never have savings to retire. If we stretch it to the extreme--which is required for such a case to be made--then we get there but we can't live in extremes at the exclusion of living a life, right? (By the by, everyone watch the episode of The Good Place with Michael McKean, Season 3 Episode 9 where McKean plays a character who tries to do live exactly like this.)

So we have to live our lives. I can [expletive] around playing 2K19 on my PlayStation for a whole Saturday afternoon and it's ok if I'm living a good life. I don't need to dedicate that Saturday afternoon to an extreme overtime plan. Failure to spend time doing good is not being bad, it's not even not being good. If life were an NBA or NHL box score with a +/- that's really what we're targeting here, yeah? What did we do with our time on the court? The +/- box score does not punish us for time on the bench, and we all need some time on the bench in life to [expletive] around playing PlayStation for an afternoon or going for a walk or watching a movie. If we take the pleasures in life and say that because they're not actively doing good so they must be bad then we're all lost. Then we can really say that literally every human is a failure. We can focus on legacy or on doing good one moment and then focus on self satisfaction the next (even if you mean that quite literally.)

Fat Strat wrote:
I think that the physical world is all there is. This is my belief. Response: No, you don't. You live in the dominant culture of this world, but I guarantee that you have some kind of imagined alternative reality that you are striving for and desiring to reach. A world where you are happy, content, significant, leaving a legacy -- whatever it is, fill in your own blanks. That world exists for you even though it is not real. You hope toward it and are determined to bring it to reality, but you don't always make the choices, decisions, or steps necessary to bring what you hope for into reality. And so, it remains an alternative and the dominant culture of the world has won again... for now. This is what Bruggemann is talking about. Except he's centering that ideal hope on God's Kingdom and you center in on your own kingdom.


I promise you I don't. I feel happy, content and significant in this world.


Last edited by 33anda3rd on January 3 19, 4:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: January 3 19, 4:30 pm 
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33anda3rd wrote:
Fat Strat wrote:
I'm consistent in what I say I believe and how I act. Response: No, you're not, at least not according to psychology/sociology. Not any more than your average Christian. I don't know you personally, so don't take that as a personal shot. We're just not consistent beings. By your own measures of goodness and significance -- which are pretty admirable, thumbs up! -- you fail most of the time. You can always do more good. You often make choices not to do good because you decide someone doesn't deserve it. You'll focus on legacy one moment then focus on self-satisfaction the next. You might feel like you're pretty consistent, but you change by mood, environment, and company and the values through which you judge yourself and your actions change with it. Moral relativism vs. absolute truth. A Christian's hypocrisy is easier to see because you can point to a written standard and see where they don't line up. It's much harder to recognize our own inconsistencies when we don't have an external source to judge ourselves against.


Ah but then we get into a slippery slope. The "I could be doing more so I'm failing." If I give $1 to a beggar but I have $5 in my pocket, I've failed. If I give two hours of my time in a shelter plating turkey on Thanksgiving but then I enjoyed myself with my family for 2 more hours that I could have been plating more turkey, I failed. And so on. I don't subscribe to that. No one can subscribe to that. We'd never go to work. We'd never have savings to retire. If we stretch it to the extreme--which is required for such a case to be made--then we get there but we can't live in extremes at the exclusion of living a life, right? (By the by, everyone watch the episode of The Good Place with Michael McKean, Season 3 Episode 9 where McKean plays a character who tries to do live exactly like this.)

So we have to live our lives. I can [expletive] around playing 2K19 on my PlayStation for a whole Saturday afternoon and it's ok if I'm living a good life. I don't need to dedicate that Saturday afternoon to an extreme overtime plan. Failure to spend time doing good is not being bad, it's not even not being good. If life were an NBA or NHL box score with a +/- that's really what we're targeting here, yeah? What did we do with our time on the court? The +/- box score does not punish us for time on the bench, and we all need some time on the bench in life to [expletive] around playing PlayStation for an afternoon or going for a walk or watching a movie. If we take the pleasures in life and say that because they're not actively doing good so they must be bad then we're all lost. Then we can really say that literally every human is a failure. We can focus on legacy or on doing good one moment and then focus on self satisfaction the next (even if you mean that quite literally.)


You kind of said exactly what he was implying. We all can't lead that perfect life that Christ preached, because we are all flawed, and we all need time for us. That is not a failing, and that is not hypocrisy, we are all humans, and humans are flawed creatures.


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PostPosted: January 3 19, 4:33 pm 
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wart57 wrote:
33anda3rd wrote:
Fat Strat wrote:
I'm consistent in what I say I believe and how I act. Response: No, you're not, at least not according to psychology/sociology. Not any more than your average Christian. I don't know you personally, so don't take that as a personal shot. We're just not consistent beings. By your own measures of goodness and significance -- which are pretty admirable, thumbs up! -- you fail most of the time. You can always do more good. You often make choices not to do good because you decide someone doesn't deserve it. You'll focus on legacy one moment then focus on self-satisfaction the next. You might feel like you're pretty consistent, but you change by mood, environment, and company and the values through which you judge yourself and your actions change with it. Moral relativism vs. absolute truth. A Christian's hypocrisy is easier to see because you can point to a written standard and see where they don't line up. It's much harder to recognize our own inconsistencies when we don't have an external source to judge ourselves against.


Ah but then we get into a slippery slope. The "I could be doing more so I'm failing." If I give $1 to a beggar but I have $5 in my pocket, I've failed. If I give two hours of my time in a shelter plating turkey on Thanksgiving but then I enjoyed myself with my family for 2 more hours that I could have been plating more turkey, I failed. And so on. I don't subscribe to that. No one can subscribe to that. We'd never go to work. We'd never have savings to retire. If we stretch it to the extreme--which is required for such a case to be made--then we get there but we can't live in extremes at the exclusion of living a life, right? (By the by, everyone watch the episode of The Good Place with Michael McKean, Season 3 Episode 9 where McKean plays a character who tries to do live exactly like this.)

So we have to live our lives. I can [expletive] around playing 2K19 on my PlayStation for a whole Saturday afternoon and it's ok if I'm living a good life. I don't need to dedicate that Saturday afternoon to an extreme overtime plan. Failure to spend time doing good is not being bad, it's not even not being good. If life were an NBA or NHL box score with a +/- that's really what we're targeting here, yeah? What did we do with our time on the court? The +/- box score does not punish us for time on the bench, and we all need some time on the bench in life to [expletive] around playing PlayStation for an afternoon or going for a walk or watching a movie. If we take the pleasures in life and say that because they're not actively doing good so they must be bad then we're all lost. Then we can really say that literally every human is a failure. We can focus on legacy or on doing good one moment and then focus on self satisfaction the next (even if you mean that quite literally.)


You kind of said exactly what he was implying. We all can't lead that perfect life that Christ preached, because we are all flawed, and we all need time for us. That is not a failing, and that is not hypocrisy, we are all humans, and humans are flawed creatures.


Right but that is not a sign of inconsistency or of hypocrisy.


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PostPosted: January 7 19, 4:44 pm 
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Jesus Christ Stars in an Upcoming DC Comics’ Series


https://relevantmagazine.com/culture/bo ... cs-series/


Quote:
“The Christian religion doesn’t really base itself on what He taught, particularly in the modern evangelical megachurches,” he told the outlet. “They have Him more as mascot on t-shirts to prove they’re on the winning team. [Second Coming] is about Jesus coming down and being appalled by what He sees has been done in His name by Christianity in the last 2,000 years. He goes by a megachurch, and they have a billboard of this Tom Brady-looking Jesus Christ throwing a football, and He doesn’t even recognize Himself which is a metaphor for Him not recognizing what’s been done with the religion that bears His name.”


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PostPosted: January 7 19, 6:24 pm 
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Has an anecdote about a townie he overheard.
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Saw a local preachers wife post.

"I don't need to care about immigrants to get into heaven, I believe Jesus is my Lord and Savior and that is enough."

Maybe that's what the bible says I don't know, but I suspect basically every Christian thinks this way at this point and that's why the religion is such cancer. She went on to say she wanted all immigrants gone and she didn't care if they had to be shot crossing the boarder.

I guess I'm at the point in my thinking where a lot of Christians are about Islam. I think Christianity needs wiped from our planet. I would peacefully accomplish this by taxing it to death.


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