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 Post subject: Re: The Tariff Thread
PostPosted: July 24 18, 6:20 pm 
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Sincere question, shouldn’t Bernie Bros be in favor of this?


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 Post subject: Re: The Tariff Thread
PostPosted: July 24 18, 6:24 pm 
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Tim wrote:
Sincere question, shouldn’t Bernie Bros be in favor of this?


In favor of what?


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 Post subject: Re: The Tariff Thread
PostPosted: July 24 18, 6:30 pm 
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cardsfansince82 wrote:
I wonder if that qualifies as Real Racism.



There are farmers of color.


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 Post subject: Re: The Tariff Thread
PostPosted: July 24 18, 6:31 pm 
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lukethedrifter wrote:
Tim wrote:
Sincere question, shouldn’t Bernie Bros be in favor of this?


In favor of what?

Giving money to farmers


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 Post subject: Re: The Tariff Thread
PostPosted: July 24 18, 6:36 pm 
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IMADreamer wrote:
cardsfansince82 wrote:
I wonder if that qualifies as Real Racism.



There are farmers of color.


Not from what I've been told. They all live in cities in horrific conditions that are also somehow lavish with government handouts...until Donald made them get a job for once.


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 Post subject: Re: The Tariff Thread
PostPosted: July 24 18, 6:52 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: The Tariff Thread
PostPosted: July 24 18, 7:03 pm 
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Tim wrote:
Sincere question, shouldn’t Bernie Bros be in favor of this?



That's a legit question. I'm torn, personally because I'm someone who has criticized neoliberalism in the past and I opposed the TPP until Trump took us out of it and then all of a sudden I was like, well if Trump's dumb ass pulled us out there was probably a reason we should have been in it after all. I get where Obama was coming from on that. From a geopolitical power perspective the TPP was really smart for the US. IT would have given us much more political and economic power in Asia as a bulwark against China. For the American worker it always seemed like a [expletive] deal though that would accelerate offshoring, which ultimately made it a deal breaker for me. That and the fact that it gave corporations the right to sue nation states in a corporate appointed appeals court for even the prospect of harming future corporate earnings as a result of government legislation. [expletive] that.

As for these tariffs, is anyone for them? They are clearly being implemented in such an idiotic and haphazard way that even if you theoretically support the idea of tariffs you can't be for these. I mean, what does Trump think is going to happen? That Chinese and European exporters are going to be so badly hurt by our tariffs that they will have their governments lower whatever barriers they've got to our imports? I know we're supposed to be the hottest economy at the dance but I'm not buying that. Europe and China held a major trade conference last week. They can just trade with each other and we're here just holding our dicks. And if it does work, how long before it translates into an increase in US wages? A looooooooooong [expletive] time probably. What do we do about the increase in consumer prices in the meantime? The cost of living here is already bad enough for a whole lot of people.


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 Post subject: Re: The Tariff Thread
PostPosted: July 24 18, 7:24 pm 
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Tim wrote:

Chaos is the goal. Dont know if there is any other 'there' there.

If you are the Europeans, what do you do? Hmmm....


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 Post subject: Re: The Tariff Thread
PostPosted: July 25 18, 1:52 am 
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Freed Roger wrote:
Quote:
“I’m very worried,” said Tom Linebarger, the chief executive of Cummins, who met with President Trump over dinner at the White House in January in a bid to dissuade him from introducing steel and aluminum tariffs or tearing up free-trade agreements.


I can't blame Joe's CEO for this meeting, -however this is the part that is bothersome and plays directly into Trump's game plan. He wants to be king and have the role of picking winners and losers. No doubt, Trump saw this notion ratified when all sorts of ass-clowns paid a visit to Trump Tower (Al Gore!?).
Maybe Cummings gets an exemption a subsidy or whatever - but the key is, they are reduced to beggars, and beholden to Trump for whatever they receive.

There is power in this control, but undoubtedly there is money in it for Trump as well.

Another factor with tariffs -as seen in saga of the nail mfg in Poplar Bluff MO Trumpland - ownership of companies are intertwined and global. They are applying for an exemption but they are affiliated with a Mexican company somehow. Scary Mexico.

Company like AB In-bev - how do tariffs work for that international conglomerate? I suspect the CEO pays Trump or one of his cronies a visit with a suitcase full of money.



This is exactly correct. The purpose of the tariffs and trade war is to get these businesses begging for help so Trump can get them to do his bidding. Donate money to X Y or Z. Whatever. It's how Putin does it but on a much larger scale.


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 Post subject: Re: The Tariff Thread
PostPosted: July 25 18, 1:59 am 
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G. Keenan wrote:
Tim wrote:
Sincere question, shouldn’t Bernie Bros be in favor of this?



That's a legit question. I'm torn, personally because I'm someone who has criticized neoliberalism in the past and I opposed the TPP until Trump took us out of it and then all of a sudden I was like, well if Trump's dumb ass pulled us out there was probably a reason we should have been in it after all. I get where Obama was coming from on that. From a geopolitical power perspective the TPP was really smart for the US. IT would have given us much more political and economic power in Asia as a bulwark against China. For the American worker it always seemed like a [expletive] deal though that would accelerate offshoring, which ultimately made it a deal breaker for me. That and the fact that it gave corporations the right to sue nation states in a corporate appointed appeals court for even the prospect of harming future corporate earnings as a result of government legislation. [expletive] that.

As for these tariffs, is anyone for them? They are clearly being implemented in such an idiotic and haphazard way that even if you theoretically support the idea of tariffs you can't be for these. I mean, what does Trump think is going to happen? That Chinese and European exporters are going to be so badly hurt by our tariffs that they will have their governments lower whatever barriers they've got to our imports? I know we're supposed to be the hottest economy at the dance but I'm not buying that. Europe and China held a major trade conference last week. They can just trade with each other and we're here just holding our dicks. And if it does work, how long before it translates into an increase in US wages? A looooooooooong [expletive] time probably. What do we do about the increase in consumer prices in the meantime? The cost of living here is already bad enough for a whole lot of people.


It is a legit question and your response mostly covered it. At the basic level, Bernie supporters are not against trade deals. They just want the deals negotiated with workers rights and environmental concerns given high priority. So Trump is right that the deals are bad but he is just going to make them worse in these respects. Its kind of like the overall economy, too. Trump was right when he said the economy sucked under Obama. But tax cuts aren't going to do anything to fix the problems, anymore than tariffs are going to fix our trade problems.


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