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 Post subject: Re: Bernie
PostPosted: August 9 19, 10:11 pm 
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Bernie shouldnt drop out and endorse warren because theres no evidence (yet) that they are competing for the same voters


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 Post subject: Re: Bernie
PostPosted: August 10 19, 8:56 am 
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33anda3rd wrote:
Big Amoco Sign wrote:
And if the debates weren’t reality TV shows obsessed with sound bites he’d be much further ahead.



Bernie is literally the soundbite guy. Wall Street. The 1%. Fossil Fuel industry. The military industrial complex. Repeat.

Warren is the policy nerd who wants to have a wonky debate about everything like an overachieving high schooler to the point some folks are like "yeah, we get it, you read a bunch," yet she's shown better at both debates than the generally more soundbite friendly Sanders.

This was exactly my observation in the last debate. Warren gave deeply thoughtful, nuanced answers that made a lot of sense, while Bernie just repeated the same old lines about everything. "We're going to eliminate student loan debt and make college free for all Americans. We're going to have Medicare for All so that everyone has access to quality healthcare. We're going to pass the Green New Deal because the future of the planet and the future of our country depend on it."


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 Post subject: Re: Bernie
PostPosted: August 10 19, 9:12 pm 
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So... which of those strategies is going to do better winning over the non-college educated?


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 Post subject: Re: Bernie
PostPosted: August 11 19, 1:48 pm 
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Schlich wrote:
Bernie shouldnt drop out and endorse warren because theres no evidence (yet) that they are competing for the same voters


Oh, don't be obtuse. Their platforms are almost identical, save Warren's desire to end the filibuster and her belief in capitalism.

Schlich wrote:
So... which of those strategies is going to do better winning over the non-college educated?


Who cares? We need to get over this obsession with uneducated angry white people, there's too much talk about our most regressive citizens. PA, MI, and WI can be won in the suburbs--Hillary lost those three states by under 80K votes combined. There are well more than 80K people in those three states who have educations and live in an urban/suburban area who either:
1. didn't vote because Clinton was unlikable
2. voted Stein because Clinton was unlikable
3. voted Trump but don't share his most polarizing views and are now turned off

In those three states there were Senate races in 2018. The Dems won all three by a combined 1.2 million votes. And that's before El Paso and Dayton (Sherrod Brown ran up the score in OH in 2018 too) and Barr lying about the Mueller Report and Mueller in Congress and Cohen in congress and Epstein and Send Her Back and joking about shooting immigrants.

Non-college educated, in this obsession people have, always turns to white guys. How about the non college educated people of color? All that stuff of the last three years, will Trump get 28% of the Latino vote again? No way. You see people who look like you in cages, you see them rounded up at work and their kids crying on the street, that number is going to drop. How many black Americans will go back to the polls after staying home in 2016, coming off four years of Trump's foolish racism?

People of color and educated sub- and urbanites will turn this election to the Democrat without us obsessing over the uneducated white man. Those voters and their stupid priorities don't deserve the overwhelming amount of weight they're being given.


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 Post subject: Re: Bernie
PostPosted: August 11 19, 5:46 pm 
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33anda3rd wrote:
Schlich wrote:
Bernie shouldnt drop out and endorse warren because theres no evidence (yet) that they are competing for the same voters


Oh, don't be obtuse. Their platforms are almost identical, save Warren's desire to end the filibuster and her belief in capitalism.

It’s the data guy, everybody!


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 Post subject: Re: Bernie
PostPosted: August 11 19, 6:43 pm 
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Schlich wrote:
Bernie shouldnt drop out and endorse warren because theres no evidence (yet) that they are competing for the same voters


"Not Donald Trump 2020." What am I missing?


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 Post subject: Re: Bernie
PostPosted: August 12 19, 6:35 am 
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Arthur Dent wrote:
33anda3rd wrote:
Schlich wrote:
Bernie shouldnt drop out and endorse warren because theres no evidence (yet) that they are competing for the same voters


Oh, don't be obtuse. Their platforms are almost identical, save Warren's desire to end the filibuster and her belief in capitalism.

It’s the data guy, everybody!


Doesn't take much data to see the overlap in Sanders and Warren. The last debate was basically the two of them arguing the exact same points against the two boring white moderates. They were interchangeable.


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 Post subject: Re: Bernie
PostPosted: August 12 19, 7:49 am 
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Similar platforms, different voters.


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 Post subject: Re: Bernie
PostPosted: August 12 19, 8:09 am 
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33anda3rd wrote:
Schlich wrote:
Bernie shouldnt drop out and endorse warren because theres no evidence (yet) that they are competing for the same voters


Oh, don't be obtuse. Their platforms are almost identical, save Warren's desire to end the filibuster and her belief in capitalism.

Schlich wrote:
So... which of those strategies is going to do better winning over the non-college educated?


Who cares? We need to get over this obsession with uneducated angry white people, there's too much talk about our most regressive citizens. PA, MI, and WI can be won in the suburbs--Hillary lost those three states by under 80K votes combined. There are well more than 80K people in those three states who have educations and live in an urban/suburban area who either:
1. didn't vote because Clinton was unlikable
2. voted Stein because Clinton was unlikable
3. voted Trump but don't share his most polarizing views and are now turned off

In those three states there were Senate races in 2018. The Dems won all three by a combined 1.2 million votes. And that's before El Paso and Dayton (Sherrod Brown ran up the score in OH in 2018 too) and Barr lying about the Mueller Report and Mueller in Congress and Cohen in congress and Epstein and Send Her Back and joking about shooting immigrants.

Non-college educated, in this obsession people have, always turns to white guys. How about the non college educated people of color? All that stuff of the last three years, will Trump get 28% of the Latino vote again? No way. You see people who look like you in cages, you see them rounded up at work and their kids crying on the street, that number is going to drop. How many black Americans will go back to the polls after staying home in 2016, coming off four years of Trump's foolish racism?

People of color and educated sub- and urbanites will turn this election to the Democrat without us obsessing over the uneducated white man. Those voters and their stupid priorities don't deserve the overwhelming amount of weight they're being given.


Schlich didn't mention white guys. He just said "non-college educated"


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 Post subject: Re: Bernie
PostPosted: August 12 19, 8:21 am 
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pioneer98 wrote:
Schlich didn't mention white guys. He just said "non-college educated"


He doesn't have to say it. 91% of black Americans and 66% of Hispanics voted Clinton. Their vote is already largely won, so asking how to win over the non-college vote as a generic term is really asking how to win the non-educated white vote.

64% of non college grad white folks: Trump
77% of non college grad non-white folks: Clinton

Image

"Non-college educated" is too often used as a catch-all for "non-college educated white people" kind of like "normal Americans" is often used as a catch-all for "working class white people." I'm kind of over both those descriptors, as well as "electable" which just means "safe white candidate." It's another means to which we normalize consideration of uneducated white religious midwestern people as "normal."


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