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This Ashley Judd column struck a chord with me, especially this excerpt,

I ask especially how we can leverage strong female-to-female alliances to confront and change that there is no winning here as women.

. You can be a woman as gorgeous as Ashley Judd and eventually everyone ages, occasionally gains weight, etc. Are women other women's worst enemy and is it the result of ingrained patriarchal values? I also agree that both sexes make harsh judgments and mean-spirited comments without even realizing they're doing it.

Edit: - And if you don't care about any topic resembling feminism, the word misogynist is used often.

Would the public notice if gossip columnists didn't write about it?

Having daughters, I'm hoping, waiting, praying (...well not praying, but) for a return of the Feminist.

planet puma wrote:Are women other women's worst enemy

I think this rings true in part. Quote from movie -Ryan Gosling's character in Crazy Stupid Love to Steve Carell's character.

The war between the sexes is over. We won the second women started doing pole dancing for exercise

Overall , I think women have caved in. And it starts young. . I know, some think the terribly uncomfortable shoes and outlandish and often sexual fashions are expressions of an independent feminist-ala Madonna or Lady Gaga -but I'm not buying that.

Personally, I prefer ladies not get as done up, fancied up as they do. If a women is good looking, they don't need to try so damn hard - men will figure it out.

I saw Ashley Judd during the NCAAs and she still fires me up.
This is awesome and hot. Ashley Judd Susan Sarandon Madeline Albright and water with fecal matter in it -oh My.
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Women that are smart, accomplished, take care of themselves physically and emotionally, and have a humble sense of self-respect are sexy, and always will be.

A bombshell who looks good in a thong but lacking in the aforementioned areas will be sexy for as long either 1) you really get to know her, or 2) another bombshell comes along to divert your attention. Point is, it won't last if the sexiness stops at the bikini line.

I love that pole dancing quote.

I know that (in my experience) women have been far more manipulative and destructive towards me than men have. I tried (at a previous job) to take several women who were angling for my job behind my back - into my fold. Give them a place within my department to learn how to do my job so if I left, they could do it - or they could go do my job for another company. I wanted to believe I could form alliances and fight the negativity. It didn't work.

I had another job where a woman wanted my job and I tried to show her how to do it and she convinced my boss if she just could take one photoshop class she could handle it (and her other job within the company, at the same time). They let me go. And eventually let her go for not being able to do either job.

I have never encountered this with men at work. I've never found a reciprocal female working relationship that was beneficial to me and I have made (see above) many efforts. I want to think we can be stronger together but it hasn't worked out that way.

What does patriarchical mean?

jim wrote:What does patriarchical mean?

Fatherly. Ruled by fathers. Or, more broadly, male-dominated or -controlled.

Competition is what makes this country great. At least that's what the men say.

But seriously, men compete with each other and fight dirty just as much as women do. I mean, the Saints' bounty program wasn't about building each other up--we men are willing to injure another man to make relative chump change. And we're coniving in the business world too. Just a little more prone to follow the philosophy of "loose lips sink ships".

docellis wrote:I love that pole dancing quote.

I know that (in my experience) women have been far more manipulative and destructive towards me than men have. I tried (at a previous job) to take several women who were angling for my job behind my back - into my fold. Give them a place within my department to learn how to do my job so if I left, they could do it - or they could go do my job for another company. I wanted to believe I could form alliances and fight the negativity. It didn't work.

I had another job where a woman wanted my job and I tried to show her how to do it and she convinced my boss if she just could take one photoshop class she could handle it (and her other job within the company, at the same time). They let me go. And eventually let her go for not being able to do either job.

I have never encountered this with men at work. I've never found a reciprocal female working relationship that was beneficial to me and I have made (see above) many efforts. I want to think we can be stronger together but it hasn't worked out that way.

doc,
I have seen this time and time again in my wife's field which is dominated by females. Sad.

planet puma wrote:Are women other women's worst enemy

Yes. I've seen more than a few articles on how women are more likely to be bullied by a woman at work than by a man. Here's one.

and is it the result of ingrained patriarchal values?

Directly? I'd say no. Indirectly? A bit more complex. I do think it's harder for women to move up the ladder, there's still pay discrepancies and some of it is rooted in patriarchal values. Since it's more difficult to achieve, I think some women are more adversarial towards other women.

That said, I think she's being a bit dramatic. I'd say women are being harsh on celebrities, especially those known for beauty, when they age or have work done out of simple jealousy. Either to tear down a beautiful woman for aging (to feel superior) or for using her means to preserve look, jealous they can't achieve the same. I'm not sure you can attribute those reactions to a patriarchal society.