3/3 ST GDT: Mets(Wheeler) vs Cardinals(Poncedeleon) 12PMCT

Discuss what's happening in the day-to-day baseball world.
User avatar
heyzeus
Everday Unicorn
Posts: 35637
Joined: April 21 06, 10:14 am
Location: Austin, TX
Contact:

Re: 3/3 ST GDT: Mets(Wheeler) vs Cardinals(Poncedeleon) 12PM

Post by heyzeus »

why not bader in center and o'neil in right? Fowler is not exactly lighting the world on fire...again.

tlombard
tl;dr
Posts: 4873
Joined: May 21 09, 12:41 pm

Re: 3/3 ST GDT: Mets(Wheeler) vs Cardinals(Poncedeleon) 12PM

Post by tlombard »

Fowler might not be lighting the world on fire right now but over the weekend I saw some stuff that I definitely liked from him. There will be a time when somebody is injured and he will play an important role this season. In watching the two games this weekend he got a couple of hits, seemed to be seeing the ball well, played good defense and I thought he did a great job running the bases.

I didn't see as much of Bader with him not starting Saturday but other than having to make a diving catch after breaking back on a ball first and getting thrown out stealing, nothing he did stood out to me in the least.

But that O'Neill bomb on Sunday. Wow. That was a freaking rocket. How did he not know that ball got out and stopped at second? If that ball didn't go over the wall, it was going through it. The swing just looked so easy and natural too.

User avatar
Big Amoco Sign
Master of Hyperbole
Posts: 7316
Joined: December 1 17, 11:05 am

Re: 3/3 ST GDT: Mets(Wheeler) vs Cardinals(Poncedeleon) 12PM

Post by Big Amoco Sign »

heyzeus wrote:why not bader in center and o'neil in right? Fowler is not exactly lighting the world on fire...again.
Because we have too many guys with bad K/BB ratios in the OF as it is. That's why we wanted Fowler over Grichuk originally.

At least with O'Neill you can live with it because of the power and the fact that he's so similar to Bader speed wise as it is.

I honestly don't understand shipping off Pham and Grichuk and replacing them with Bader and O'Neill besides getting younger. Corner OF should be used for a better plate disciplined guy. We can sacrifice glove in the corners.

User avatar
heyzeus
Everday Unicorn
Posts: 35637
Joined: April 21 06, 10:14 am
Location: Austin, TX
Contact:

Re: 3/3 ST GDT: Mets(Wheeler) vs Cardinals(Poncedeleon) 12PM

Post by heyzeus »

O'Neill's track record in the minors features lots of homers, strikeouts, and walks. Grichuk's, just the homers and strikeouts. I don't know enough to say which is better defensively.

I'm fine with giving Fowler a chance. We know he can be a good player; I guess I'm just suggesting that it can't be a long leash, because there's a not-zero chance he's washed. And the best chance of having CF/RF combine for 7+ WAR would almost certainly be Bader/O'Neill.

Postscript: The Pham trade really is one of the more incomprehensible things the team's done in recent memory. It was like we did a rebuild without trading off any salaries or acquiring young talent to build around. And I don't think I've seen anyone defend it.

User avatar
Big Amoco Sign
Master of Hyperbole
Posts: 7316
Joined: December 1 17, 11:05 am

Re: 3/3 ST GDT: Mets(Wheeler) vs Cardinals(Poncedeleon) 12PM

Post by Big Amoco Sign »

All of Fowler's issues seem to be related to the foot. It affects his speed/fielding and getting set up in the box. I still believe he's got a good batting eye and can make decent swings. I wonder if foot is affecting his contact somehow in regards to his swing.

Agreed RE: Pham. Trade still makes no sense. Could use that depth/fix at RF. I understand needing O'Neill to get playing time but I see him getting lots of playing time with or without Pham.

dmarx114
Hall Of Famer
Posts: 21030
Joined: December 20 07, 2:45 pm

Re: 3/3 ST GDT: Mets(Wheeler) vs Cardinals(Poncedeleon) 12PM

Post by dmarx114 »

heyzeus wrote:O'Neill's track record in the minors features lots of homers, strikeouts, and walks. Grichuk's, just the homers and strikeouts. I don't know enough to say which is better defensively.

I'm fine with giving Fowler a chance. We know he can be a good player; I guess I'm just suggesting that it can't be a long leash, because there's a not-zero chance he's washed. And the best chance of having CF/RF combine for 7+ WAR would almost certainly be Bader/O'Neill.

Postscript: The Pham trade really is one of the more incomprehensible things the team's done in recent memory. It was like we did a rebuild without trading off any salaries or acquiring young talent to build around. And I don't think I've seen anyone defend it.
How can we fairly analyze a trade without seeing how the guys who were acquired will perform at the MLB level?

The Pham trade is very much an incomplete.

User avatar
Big Amoco Sign
Master of Hyperbole
Posts: 7316
Joined: December 1 17, 11:05 am

Re: 3/3 ST GDT: Mets(Wheeler) vs Cardinals(Poncedeleon) 12PM

Post by Big Amoco Sign »

Have my doubts that any of those players will accumulate the WAR Pham did in a half a year last year.

But that’s me.

dmarx114
Hall Of Famer
Posts: 21030
Joined: December 20 07, 2:45 pm

Re: 3/3 ST GDT: Mets(Wheeler) vs Cardinals(Poncedeleon) 12PM

Post by dmarx114 »

Big Amoco Sign wrote:Have my doubts that any of those players will accumulate the WAR Pham did in a half a year last year.

But that’s me.
It's fine to have doubts.

But we need to see how everyone in the trade performs throughout the rest of their careers before we claim that this trade was a mistake by Mo.

Post Reply