Stroman Watch (p. 4 Stroman to Cubs)

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go birds
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Re: Stroman Watch (p. 4 Stroman to Cubs)

Post by go birds »

MO’s a [expletive] stooge

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mikechamp
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Re: Stroman Watch

Post by mikechamp »

Socnorb11 wrote:
December 2 21, 12:16 pm
The difference between the Cardinals and every other playoff contender isn't Stroman. The difference is that every other playoff contender has elite talent on their roster that they drafted and/or developed. Every team. The Cardinals do not.
I know he is past his prime now, but I would argue Yadi was considered an elite catcher at some point during his career.

Jack Flaherty isn't too shabby, either.

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Re: Stroman Watch

Post by Socnorb11 »

mikechamp wrote:
December 2 21, 12:49 pm
Socnorb11 wrote:
December 2 21, 12:16 pm
The difference between the Cardinals and every other playoff contender isn't Stroman. The difference is that every other playoff contender has elite talent on their roster that they drafted and/or developed. Every team. The Cardinals do not.
I know he is past his prime now, but I would argue Yadi was considered an elite catcher at some point during his career.

Jack Flaherty isn't too shabby, either.
You're going WAAAAAAY back with Yadi.

Flaherty has 1 elite year under his belt.

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Popeye_Card
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Re: Stroman Watch (p. 4 Stroman to Cubs)

Post by Popeye_Card »

Famous Mortimer wrote:
December 2 21, 12:42 pm
I hope all the people who prioritise the profits of the owners of baseball teams over the product they put on the field is enjoying the fruits of their labours today.
You have quite the obsession with these mythical beasts.

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Re: Stroman Watch (p. 4 Stroman to Cubs)

Post by Socnorb11 »

Famous Mortimer wrote:
December 2 21, 12:42 pm
I hope all the people who prioritise the profits of the owners of baseball teams over the product they put on the field is enjoying the fruits of their labours today.
Define "prioritize"?

Because I don't complain about ownership in every thread on a message board, I'm prioritizing profits?

We have what we have. As long as you continue to invest time and resources toward the team, you're prioritizing their profits too.

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haltz
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Re: Stroman Watch (p. 4 Stroman to Cubs)

Post by haltz »

Big Amoco Sign wrote:
December 2 21, 12:18 pm
Superorganism wrote:
December 2 21, 12:14 pm
Is Stroman that much better than Matz? Some would argue no.
More than double the career WAR but OK (With taking the COVID season off). Higher projections. Outperforms expected numbers better.
Double the career WAR is meaningless when it comes to what they'll do next season and you know that. Obviously Stroman is better, but the protections are like half a win better (3.0 to 2.5). They're pretty similar pitchers with some relatively small differences in strikeouts, workload and ground balls.

I'll take Matz and something else over Stroman all day long - it's that something else part that's the sticking point right now.

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Big Amoco Sign
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Re: Stroman Watch (p. 4 Stroman to Cubs)

Post by Big Amoco Sign »

I’m bringing up the career WAR because of the ability to produce. Stroman doesn’t have the slew of injuries in his history that Matz does. I don’t think Matz pitches over 150 innings. Hell I’d be happy if he got close. Stroman tends to outperform his projections, doesn’t he? So a 3 WAR can be 3.5.

We shall see.

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Re: Stroman Watch (p. 4 Stroman to Cubs)

Post by MrCrowesGarden »

haltz wrote:
December 2 21, 1:03 pm
Big Amoco Sign wrote:
December 2 21, 12:18 pm
Superorganism wrote:
December 2 21, 12:14 pm
Is Stroman that much better than Matz? Some would argue no.
More than double the career WAR but OK (With taking the COVID season off). Higher projections. Outperforms expected numbers better.
Double the career WAR is meaningless when it comes to what they'll do next season and you know that. Obviously Stroman is better, but the protections are like half a win better (3.0 to 2.5). They're pretty similar pitchers with some relatively small differences in strikeouts, workload and ground balls.

I'll take Matz and something else over Stroman all day long - it's that something else part that's the sticking point right now.
I saw it mentioned on Twitter that there's a chance Story takes a pillow contract. That's still probably going to be more than the Cardinals will spend but wouldn't be opposed to it.

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Re: Stroman Watch (p. 4 Stroman to Cubs)

Post by Popeye_Card »

Not a big Story fan, but I could slowly get on board with a Matz + Story + LH backup OF offseason. It would still be a pretty massive disappointment, but it is a pretty strong 2022 roster on paper.

I'd be more on board if there was a package around DeJong going to the A's for another SP. It still wouldn't bring the #1/#2 type starter I think the Cardinals still need, but the added depth would make me feel a lot better.

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Big Amoco Sign
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Re: Stroman Watch (p. 4 Stroman to Cubs)

Post by Big Amoco Sign »

Story is the one move that I don’t want them to do.

You get his production all day from Sosa/DeJong/Edman (when Gorman plays).

If you want more wins than current output at SS. Go Correa or find other upgrades (pitching).

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