When Will We Know America is a Fascist State?

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lukethedrifter
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Re: When Will We Know America is a Fascist State?

Post by lukethedrifter »

Fat Strat wrote:
pioneer98 wrote:
MAGA wrote:You’re calling the nazis when someone breaks into your house?

That’s odd.
We do know that white supremacists have tried to infiltrate police forces, but that was not really the point. I didn't call cops Nazis with that image. The point was more that the kind of people who fly a "Blue Lives Matter" flag are pretty Nazi-like. The police are largely just doing what they are told by their superiors. Why do some people think cops need a cheering section? It's so odd to me.

In my town police have such a backlog that, if your car is stolen, there is a good chance they won't even investigate it. They are overwhelmed. So the top brass of the police have to prioritize what they work on. Stolen cars have become a lower priority. Cracking down on homeless people and crime near the gentrifying downtown area has become one of their higher priorities. Basically, the police's top priorities align with what the powerful business people in my town want. The cops are there to protect those folks' interests and investments more than anyone else's. And all those powerful business people are rich white people, the kind of people who would fly a "Blue Lives Matter" flag.

The police themselves are not pure evil or something. That's not what I'm saying. The police still do some good things that serve the wider community, but more and more, they seem to be serving fewer and fewer people. It's more a problem of the politics behind the police than the police themselves. If we had a stronger community presence in our politics deciding how to use our limited police resources, I think the police would be doing more work that would benefit the whole community.
Have you worked directly with police in any capacity other than crime - like your car being stolen? Because my wife and I have both worked closely with police in our own, very different capacities and in very different environments - small town and bigger city - and what you are saying here about police only protecting the interests of the rich and serving a small % of the populations doesn’t even remotely fit with my experiences. In fact, I would say that the exact opposite is true in both environments where I have worked with police and civilian leaders.

I also find your last comments curious and highly questionable because the police I have worked with in both suburban and urban environments have begged and begged and begged and begged private citizens to organize toward that “strong community presence” you seem to desire. As have the civic leaders who are responsible for those budgets. The police and the civic government probably aren’t the problem if there is a lack of community organization.

Police departments across the country have fought to keep civilians- at least those they don’t control- from any oversight capacity. It’s not really debatable.
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Re: When Will We Know America is a Fascist State?

Post by Fat Strat »

lukethedrifter wrote:Police departments across the country have fought to keep civilians- at least those they don’t control- from any oversight capacity. It’s not really debatable.
Maybe in terms of direct budgetary or punitive/regulatory oversight, but, frankly, that's a small part of the bigger picture and there are legal processes for that. In the majority of communities, there are fairly easy ways to get involved in those areas -- running for office. Working directly with city councils. There are committees and points of engagements already created where those conversations can happen. If you are in a town of under 100,000 - by far the majority of communities in the US -- it's probably a regular thing for city council positions to run unopposed. If you want a voice, then speak up. If you want change, then create change. The opportunities are there if you are willing to take them. And if you don't want to run for office, then organize on a lower level -- I have yet to find a local government or a local police force that isn't desperate for community engagement and who don't welcome conversation/dialogue with organized community groups -- especially when the groups are organized around helping their communities. Now, if your mission is "our police force is terrible and facist and we want to control it" then, no, you'll probably not be welcomed with open arms. But, if your organized mission is "we care about our community and want to make it a safe, prosperous place" then the police/local government will probably cheer you on and try to help you as much as they can -- considering their own limited resources and availability.

Sorry, but in my experience, most people -- maybe not people around here -- have read some articles and heard some new reports and drawn conclusions about their own communities and they have neither taken any action to organize within their community, engaged with government in their community, dialogued with police in their community, or generally taken any steps at all to improve their community (short of just living there).
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lukethedrifter
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Re: When Will We Know America is a Fascist State?

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There are a whole lot of people who would vehemently disagree with you, Fat. I don’t doubt your sincerity at all but it shouldn’t take you very long to find the folks with a very different experience.
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pioneer98
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Re: When Will We Know America is a Fascist State?

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The police in my town of just over 100,000 people are complicit in trying to take power away from our civil rights commission. They don't want to hear what the community has to say, especially the minority communities. So, yeah, we do need people to run for office and we do need to do more community organizing. Like, lots more.
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Re: When Will We Know America is a Fascist State?

Post by Joe Shlabotnik »

Ashland Or (town of 25000 +/-)lost a police officer last yearand there was an outpouring of grief and support for his family.

I can attest that this guy was one of those who took 'To Serve and Protect' seriously. An aquaintance of mine had a nervous breakdown and was wondering the streets when he encountered this officer who helped him get to help instead of the things we hear about that end badly. His memorial was attended by hundreds of people and even my sons, who do not have good feelings for most cops were sad to hear about his death.

Exception to the rule I guess. We need more like Malcus Williams and we need to actively find them and support them.
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Re: When Will We Know America is a Fascist State?

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not sure where to put it but assange got arrested by british police
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Re: When Will We Know America is a Fascist State?

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I didn’t realize the dude is 80 yrs old.
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Mary1966
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Re: When Will We Know America is a Fascist State?

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Radbird wrote: I didn’t realize the dude is 80 yrs old.
Ruptly is RT’s video service. Appropriate for Assange.
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Re: When Will We Know America is a Fascist State?

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Re: When Will We Know America is a Fascist State?

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https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/ ... at-records
A Washington state Republican politician took part in private discussions with rightwing figures about carrying out surveillance, “psyops” and even violent attacks on perceived political enemies, according to chat records obtained by the Guardian.
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