St. Louis Fans: Gutless?

[wart57]

I am surprised that the ghost of ducky joe didnt remember the st louis browns.

He probably did, but because they're the Browns, they don't really count.

I did in fact forget about the Browns. I don't know enough about the 1950s team and the climate of the town. I suppose that the Cards' popularity at the time was at a zenith and the Brownie attendance was dipping.

But that's just a guess.

I sure it was about $, just like every other team that moved - to make more money.

[obucard]

I am surprised that the ghost of ducky joe didnt remember the st louis browns.

He probably did, but because they're the Browns, they don't really count.

I did in fact forget about the Browns. I don't know enough about the 1950s team and the climate of the town. I suppose that the Cards' popularity at the time was at a zenith and the Brownie attendance was dipping.

But that's just a guess.

I sure it was about $, just like every other team that moved - to make more money.

A story I read is that when the Cards went up for sale in the early 50s the Browns were going to use the fact that they owned Sportsman's Park to try to force the new owner to move the team. When the new owner turned out to be Gussie Busch they realized that strategy had no chance of happening, so they sold the Park to Busch and left themselves.

[ZigZagCardsFan]

[Diddy]

SLSF is that you?

Was he the "Our Season is Over" guy?

Yes

Saint Louis sports fan

[Radbird]

I am surprised that the ghost of ducky joe didnt remember the st louis browns.

He probably did, but because they're the Browns, they don't really count.

I did in fact forget about the Browns. I don't know enough about the 1950s team and the climate of the town. I suppose that the Cards' popularity at the time was at a zenith and the Brownie attendance was dipping.

But that's just a guess.

I sure it was about $, just like every other team that moved - to make more money.

A story I read is that when the Cards went up for sale in the early 50s the Browns were going to use the fact that they owned Sportsman's Park to try to force the new owner to move the team. When the new owner turned out to be Gussie Busch they realized that strategy had no chance of happening, so they sold the Park to Busch and left themselves.

How close did Cardinals come to moving to Milwaukee?

[Radbird]

The franchise moves that almost happened

The Milwaukee Browns—1954

The city of St. Louis had two ball clubs and two very different owners during the late 1940s and early 1950s. The Cardinals were run by Fred Saigh, who bought the team from Sam Breadon. The Redbirds could not match their success from the early and mid 1940s under Saigh’s leadership.

Meanwhile the Browns were run by Bill Veeck. He famously brought in midget Eddie Gaedel to bat in a Browns game. He brought in Satchel Paige to pitch. Plus he had the two greatest figures of Cardinals history on the Browns payroll. Rogers Hornsby managed the team and Dizzy Dean was the broadcaster. Veeck knew that St. Louis couldn’t support two teams and seemed determined to make that team the Browns. When Saigh was convicted on tax evasion charges during the 1952 season, out-of-town investors looked to buy the team and move it.

However, the Busch family bought the team and pumped Anheuser Busch money into the team. Veeck knew he couldn’t compete with Budweiser, so he looked to move the club to Milwaukee for the 1954 season. But the owners, who never cared for the theatrical Veeck, blocked the move. They also blocked his proposed move to Baltimore until he sold the team to Baltimore investors.

If Veeck had sold the team to a Milwaukee investor, the Browns would have returned to their original home. (They played as the Milwaukee Brewers in 1901 and 1902 before moving to St. Louis.) The Braves would have had to find a different home. Maybe they would have been the Baltimore Braves. And maybe the Seattle Pilots would have been given more than a year to survive before heading to Milwaukee.

[Medwick's Ghost]

The franchise moves that almost happened

The Milwaukee Browns—1954

The city of St. Louis had two ball clubs and two very different owners during the late 1940s and early 1950s. The Cardinals were run by Fred Saigh, who bought the team from Sam Breadon. The Redbirds could not match their success from the early and mid 1940s under Saigh’s leadership.

Meanwhile the Browns were run by Bill Veeck. He famously brought in midget Eddie Gaedel to bat in a Browns game. He brought in Satchel Paige to pitch. Plus he had the two greatest figures of Cardinals history on the Browns payroll. Rogers Hornsby managed the team and Dizzy Dean was the broadcaster. Veeck knew that St. Louis couldn’t support two teams and seemed determined to make that team the Browns. When Saigh was convicted on tax evasion charges during the 1952 season, out-of-town investors looked to buy the team and move it.

However, the Busch family bought the team and pumped Anheuser Busch money into the team. Veeck knew he couldn’t compete with Budweiser, so he looked to move the club to Milwaukee for the 1954 season. But the owners, who never cared for the theatrical Veeck, blocked the move. They also blocked his proposed move to Baltimore until he sold the team to Baltimore investors.

If Veeck had sold the team to a Milwaukee investor, the Browns would have returned to their original home. (They played as the Milwaukee Brewers in 1901 and 1902 before moving to St. Louis.) The Braves would have had to find a different home. Maybe they would have been the Baltimore Braves. And maybe the Seattle Pilots would have been given more than a year to survive before heading to Milwaukee.

Good read, Rad. Some of it I knew, some I didn't.

[Medwick's Ghost]

SLSF is that you?

Was he the "Our Season is Over" guy?

Yes

Saint Louis sports fan

For what it's worth....I'm not he.

[M1IRONMIKE]

I tend to think so. They let the Hawks get away. They let the Big Red and Rams get away. Now they are letting the Cardinals get away with (baseball) murder.

Point one: The ostracization of Ozzie Smith by La Russa. Why no uproar?

Point two: Matheney being named manager over a slew of better options, one of which that is now DONE with the team in Oquendo. Why no groundswell of decent?

Point three and the one that grates my ass the most: An overpaid, free swinging meathead batting 3rd in the order between two far superior hitters. It's insanity. Prolonged insanity. But is he ever booed? No. He would be booed in NY, Chicago, Philly and other cities and it would get national attention forcing the FO to do the right thing.

But St. Louis fans just sit on their dwindling laurels, complacent, thus complicit.

Not gutless.....patient.....because in the end we know we will win

[Radbird]

SLSF is that you?

Was he the "Our Season is Over" guy?

Yes

Saint Louis sports fan

For what it's worth....I'm not he.

Damtoft?