Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin

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PujolJunkie
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Re: Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin: The Thread

Post by PujolJunkie »

haltz wrote:
UK wrote:Let it be known I disagree with Obama on gay marriage, he offers a pedal instead of a flower and there isn't an excuse for that, except catering.
I agree.

Nate's back with more:
The way to evaluate a speech like this is by what people are going to remember in the morning, and the only thing that people are going to remember about this speech in the morning is that she went after Obama -- a lot -- and that at times it it seemed fairly personal. It was almost kind of fun at first -- I don't think people saw it coming, and she got three or four really good lines in. But then it became too much -- sarcastic and mean-spirited. Everything else -- the outsider stuff, the family stuff, the media critique -- is going to be forgotten about. In fact, the Republicans will look like whiners if they go after the media after that speech.

I don't think the Republicans are doing as good a job as the Democrats were doing about pairing their speeches to the strengths of the speaker. It's as if they wrote seven or eight speeches, and drew lots to determine who would deliver which one. So you have Mitt Romney -- one of the wealthiest men ever to run for office -- critiquing east-coast elitism, and Mike Huckabee -- who is an economic populist in disguise -- critiquing big government, and Sarah Palin -- who voters don't know one iota about -- critiquing Barack Obama's biography.
Nate is spot freaking on. He just is. Period.

Another thing, who is Sarah Palin to say "He's wrote two biographies but hasn't penned significant legislation in the Senate?"

Paging Senator McCain. Senator McCain!
Sens. Barack Obama (D-IL) and Tom Coburn (R-OK) have joined forces again to craft legislation that would increase the transparency of how the federal government spends taxpayers' money. The Strengthening Transparency and Accountability in Federal Spending Act (S. 3077), introduced June 3, is a follow-up to the 2006 Transparency Act, which was also spearheaded by the two senators.

Obama and Coburn, along with Sens. Tom Carper (D-DE) and John McCain (R-AZ), introduced the new legislation with the goals of making important new data easily accessible and enabling citizens to hold our government accountable for the fiscal stewardship of our shared resources.
Just one that stood out in my mind.

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Re: Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin: The Thread

Post by TimeForGuinness »

UK wrote:
TimeForGuinness wrote:
UK wrote:
TimeForGuinness wrote:I really hope that one of these days, America wakes up and realizes that it's ok to be a moderate.
I'd rather be moderate than far left as my social views prevent me from doing so though. It's frustrating in a way to realize that if I take my views step by step, it falls in line with the left everytime. If someone has similar views as me, I believe they are going to be what's best for this country.
++ I feel the same way.
There is an issue that I do agree with the right, that is I'm pro-death penalty.

Ironically, the very far right and myself have parallel views concerning gov't control. We want a less intrusive gov't protecting everyday freedoms and are likely as disenchanted with Bush as I have been espec. with issues like wiretapping/Patriot Act.

I just differ in that I want freedom for all and they want freedom for themselves. Ask the gay marriage question, if you want proof of the difference.

Show me how a gay couple getting married stains my marriage, disrupts my life, or prevents me from doing something I would've done had it not been for their marriage?

I don't see cherry picking the bible as a valid reason, there isn't a person alive that has conducted their lives word by word from any testament.
You and I would get along fine...we're pretty much identical

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Re: Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin: The Thread

Post by PujolJunkie »

And now Sarah Palin has her own Lite version of Rev. Wright.
But Kalnins has begun to gain attention from observers of the 2008 presidential campaign. The Huffington Post political website reported yesterday that Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, the presumptive Republican vice presidential nominee, may have drawn her religious convictions from the Pentecostal church where Kalnins has delivered his evangelical sermons since 1999.

Before then, Kalnins spent about five years at the Lambertville Assembly of God Church in West Amwell -- first as a youth minister then as associate pastor, he said.

Since taking his sermons to Alaska, Kalnins has preached that critics of President Bush will be banished to hell; questioned whether people who voted for Sen. John Kerry in 2004 would be accepted into heaven; and preached that the Sept. 11 attacks and the war in Iraq were part of a world war over Christianity, The Huffington Post reported after reviewing recorded sermons by Kalnins.

.....

"Every state has its prophetic calling ... from the Lord," he said. "Some states are stronger than others. I believe Alaska is going to be one of the sources of refuge ... just like California, Wisconsin, New York, New Jersey."
http://www.nj.com/news/times/index.ssf? ... xml&coll=5

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Re: Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin: The Thread

Post by ghostrunner »

So here's what seems to be a pretty fair article on the Bridge, and based on that I'd agree she's taking too much credit. From what I can tell, Congress had removed a stipulation that the money be used for the bridge already, but allowed them to use the money elsewhere. It does appear that she essentially killed the project as far as the state is concerned, though she didn't say "No" to Congress.

http://news.bostonherald.com/news/2008/ ... osition=12
Last edited by ghostrunner on September 3 08, 11:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin: The Thread

Post by PujolJunkie »

TimeForGuinness wrote:
UK wrote:
TimeForGuinness wrote:
UK wrote:
TimeForGuinness wrote:I really hope that one of these days, America wakes up and realizes that it's ok to be a moderate.
I'd rather be moderate than far left as my social views prevent me from doing so though. It's frustrating in a way to realize that if I take my views step by step, it falls in line with the left everytime. If someone has similar views as me, I believe they are going to be what's best for this country.
++ I feel the same way.
There is an issue that I do agree with the right, that is I'm pro-death penalty.

Ironically, the very far right and myself have parallel views concerning gov't control. We want a less intrusive gov't protecting everyday freedoms and are likely as disenchanted with Bush as I have been espec. with issues like wiretapping/Patriot Act.

I just differ in that I want freedom for all and they want freedom for themselves. Ask the gay marriage question, if you want proof of the difference.

Show me how a gay couple getting married stains my marriage, disrupts my life, or prevents me from doing something I would've done had it not been for their marriage?

I don't see cherry picking the bible as a valid reason, there isn't a person alive that has conducted their lives word by word from any testament.
You and I would get along fine...we're pretty much identical
I agree with both of you and it's one of the issues I definitely disagree with Obama on. I'm 100% for gay marriage and I don't see why it is such a problem.

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Schlich
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Re: Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin: The Thread

Post by Schlich »

PujolJunkie wrote:
haltz wrote:
UK wrote:Let it be known I disagree with Obama on gay marriage, he offers a pedal instead of a flower and there isn't an excuse for that, except catering.
I agree.

Nate's back with more:
The way to evaluate a speech like this is by what people are going to remember in the morning, and the only thing that people are going to remember about this speech in the morning is that she went after Obama -- a lot -- and that at times it it seemed fairly personal. It was almost kind of fun at first -- I don't think people saw it coming, and she got three or four really good lines in. But then it became too much -- sarcastic and mean-spirited. Everything else -- the outsider stuff, the family stuff, the media critique -- is going to be forgotten about. In fact, the Republicans will look like whiners if they go after the media after that speech.

I don't think the Republicans are doing as good a job as the Democrats were doing about pairing their speeches to the strengths of the speaker. It's as if they wrote seven or eight speeches, and drew lots to determine who would deliver which one. So you have Mitt Romney -- one of the wealthiest men ever to run for office -- critiquing east-coast elitism, and Mike Huckabee -- who is an economic populist in disguise -- critiquing big government, and Sarah Palin -- who voters don't know one iota about -- critiquing Barack Obama's biography.
Nate is spot freaking on. He just is. Period.

Another thing, who is Sarah Palin to say "He's wrote two biographies but hasn't penned significant legislation in the Senate?"

Paging Senator McCain. Senator McCain!
Sens. Barack Obama (D-IL) and Tom Coburn (R-OK) have joined forces again to craft legislation that would increase the transparency of how the federal government spends taxpayers' money. The Strengthening Transparency and Accountability in Federal Spending Act (S. 3077), introduced June 3, is a follow-up to the 2006 Transparency Act, which was also spearheaded by the two senators.

Obama and Coburn, along with Sens. Tom Carper (D-DE) and John McCain (R-AZ), introduced the new legislation with the goals of making important new data easily accessible and enabling citizens to hold our government accountable for the fiscal stewardship of our shared resources.
Just one that stood out in my mind.
Are you saying that Palin made these "attacks?" you can't be. surely. show me where.

These are the ONLY parts of Palin's speech where she talks about Obama, and to me, it's nowhere near red meat.
Sarah Palin wrote:
I guess a small-town mayor is sort of like a “community organizer,” except that you have actual responsibilities. I might add that in small towns, we don’t quite know what to make of a candidate who lavishes praise on working people when they are listening, and then talks about how bitterly they cling to their religion and guns when those people aren’t listening.

We tend to prefer candidates who don’t talk about us one way in Scranton and another way in San Francisco.

But listening to him speak, it’s easy to forget that this is a man who has authored two memoirs but not a single major law or reform - not even in the state senate.

...

This is a man who can give an entire speech about the wars America is fighting, and never use the word “victory” except when he’s talking about his own campaign. But when the cloud of rhetoric has passed … when the roar of the crowd fades away … when the stadium lights go out, and those Styrofoam Greek columns are hauled back to some studio lot - what exactly is our opponent’s plan? What does he actually seek to accomplish, after he’s done turning back the waters and healing the planet? The answer is to make government bigger … take more of your money … give you more orders from Washington … and to reduce the strength of America in a dangerous world. America needs more energy … our opponent is against producing it.

Victory in Iraq is finally in sight … he wants to forfeit.

Terrorist states are seeking new-clear weapons without delay … he wants to meet them without preconditions.

Al Qaeda terrorists still plot to inflict catastrophic harm on America … he’s worried that someone won’t read them their rights? Government is too big … he wants to grow it.

Congress spends too much … he promises more.

Taxes are too high … he wants to raise them. His tax increases are the fine print in his economic plan, and let me be specific.

The Democratic nominee for president supports plans to raise income taxes … raise payroll taxes … raise investment income taxes … raise the death tax … raise business taxes … and increase the tax burden on the American people by hundreds of billions of dollars. My sister Heather and her husband have just built a service station that’s now opened for business - like millions of others who run small businesses.
And then some comment about how Obama doesn't fight for us, McCain does.

Now.

Whether you agree or disagree with those statements. THEY ARE NOT what you have been claiming what has been said by HER. Not about his family, not about his religion, his background, anything personal, but his policies. About things that HE said.

Did others say things? I don't know, because i wasn't watching them, because THEY'RE not running for VP. Their advice and opinions matter no more to me than any citizen of the United States.

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Re: Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin: The Thread

Post by InvincibleCakeEater »

RxOfCowbell wrote:
PujolJunkie wrote:
haltz wrote:
UK wrote:Let it be known I disagree with Obama on gay marriage, he offers a pedal instead of a flower and there isn't an excuse for that, except catering.
I agree.

Nate's back with more:
The way to evaluate a speech like this is by what people are going to remember in the morning, and the only thing that people are going to remember about this speech in the morning is that she went after Obama -- a lot -- and that at times it it seemed fairly personal. It was almost kind of fun at first -- I don't think people saw it coming, and she got three or four really good lines in. But then it became too much -- sarcastic and mean-spirited. Everything else -- the outsider stuff, the family stuff, the media critique -- is going to be forgotten about. In fact, the Republicans will look like whiners if they go after the media after that speech.

I don't think the Republicans are doing as good a job as the Democrats were doing about pairing their speeches to the strengths of the speaker. It's as if they wrote seven or eight speeches, and drew lots to determine who would deliver which one. So you have Mitt Romney -- one of the wealthiest men ever to run for office -- critiquing east-coast elitism, and Mike Huckabee -- who is an economic populist in disguise -- critiquing big government, and Sarah Palin -- who voters don't know one iota about -- critiquing Barack Obama's biography.
Nate is spot freaking on. He just is. Period.

Another thing, who is Sarah Palin to say "He's wrote two biographies but hasn't penned significant legislation in the Senate?"

Paging Senator McCain. Senator McCain!
Sens. Barack Obama (D-IL) and Tom Coburn (R-OK) have joined forces again to craft legislation that would increase the transparency of how the federal government spends taxpayers' money. The Strengthening Transparency and Accountability in Federal Spending Act (S. 3077), introduced June 3, is a follow-up to the 2006 Transparency Act, which was also spearheaded by the two senators.

Obama and Coburn, along with Sens. Tom Carper (D-DE) and John McCain (R-AZ), introduced the new legislation with the goals of making important new data easily accessible and enabling citizens to hold our government accountable for the fiscal stewardship of our shared resources.
Just one that stood out in my mind.
Are you saying that Palin made these "attacks?" you can't be. surely. show me where.

These are the ONLY parts of Palin's speech where she talks about Obama, and to me, it's nowhere near red meat.
Sarah Palin wrote:
I guess a small-town mayor is sort of like a “community organizer,” except that you have actual responsibilities. I might add that in small towns, we don’t quite know what to make of a candidate who lavishes praise on working people when they are listening, and then talks about how bitterly they cling to their religion and guns when those people aren’t listening.

We tend to prefer candidates who don’t talk about us one way in Scranton and another way in San Francisco.

But listening to him speak, it’s easy to forget that this is a man who has authored two memoirs but not a single major law or reform - not even in the state senate.

...

This is a man who can give an entire speech about the wars America is fighting, and never use the word “victory” except when he’s talking about his own campaign. But when the cloud of rhetoric has passed … when the roar of the crowd fades away … when the stadium lights go out, and those Styrofoam Greek columns are hauled back to some studio lot - what exactly is our opponent’s plan? What does he actually seek to accomplish, after he’s done turning back the waters and healing the planet? The answer is to make government bigger … take more of your money … give you more orders from Washington … and to reduce the strength of America in a dangerous world. America needs more energy … our opponent is against producing it.

Victory in Iraq is finally in sight … he wants to forfeit.

Terrorist states are seeking new-clear weapons without delay … he wants to meet them without preconditions.

Al Qaeda terrorists still plot to inflict catastrophic harm on America … he’s worried that someone won’t read them their rights? Government is too big … he wants to grow it.

Congress spends too much … he promises more.

Taxes are too high … he wants to raise them. His tax increases are the fine print in his economic plan, and let me be specific.

The Democratic nominee for president supports plans to raise income taxes … raise payroll taxes … raise investment income taxes … raise the death tax … raise business taxes … and increase the tax burden on the American people by hundreds of billions of dollars. My sister Heather and her husband have just built a service station that’s now opened for business - like millions of others who run small businesses.
And then some comment about how Obama doesn't fight for us, McCain does.

Now.

Whether you agree or disagree with those statements. THEY ARE NOT what you have been claiming what has been said by HER. Not about his family, not about his religion, his background, anything personal, but his policies. About things that HE said.

Did others say things? I don't know, because i wasn't watching them, because THEY'RE not running for VP. Their advice and opinions matter no more to me than any citizen of the United States.
I think you just grabbed the funniest excerpt from the entire speech. It's just flat out ignorant.

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Schlich
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Re: Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin: The Thread

Post by Schlich »

InvincibleCakeEater wrote: I think you just grabbed the funniest excerpt from the entire speech. It's just flat out ignorant.
it's not the point i'm trying to make. I'm just trying to calm Junkie down from his biased view of the speech given by Palin. No trash. At least not the way he's making it out to be.

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Re: Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin: The Thread

Post by Jocephus »

[/youtube]

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Re: Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin: The Thread

Post by Michael »

Jocephus wrote:
[/youtube]

that video didn't last long on youtube.

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