GatewayRedbirds.com

Hudler wrote:

letsgocards89 wrote:Obama's prime-time ad skips over budget realities

No one wants to dicuss this?

What is there to discuss? McCain's plans are no more realistic. I expect both to spin them as if feasible.

Hudler wrote:

letsgocards89 wrote:Obama's prime-time ad skips over budget realities

No one wants to dicuss this?

Many allegations that I've heard before and throughout the entire article it's "Some economists," "One organization," "So and so said."

Obama has already said he's going to do his best to cut spending by eliminating programs that don't work and by getting us out of Quagmire. If you really want to see everything, go to www.barackobama.com. Look through there. People ask a ton of questions, but never bother to go and look at the [expletive] of information he has on his website. And I mean megaton-load.

Hudler wrote:

letsgocards89 wrote:Obama's prime-time ad skips over budget realities

No one wants to dicuss this?

I basically agree with that, but as I've pointed out several times before, McCain's proposals are even less in line with "budget realities".

In 2004, I voted for John Kerry. But that's not really true. I voted against George Bush. I couldn't articulate any particular policy reasons to vote for Kerry, other than he's a Democrat (which I generally side with). But I knew, and most of my friends knew, that our vote was against the war and social and economic policies of Bush.

And Kerry lost soundly. It's my theory that any time the general reason people will vote for a candidate is to vote against the other guy, they'll lose. Because the core base of democrats and republicans don't determine the election. The creamy middle of America does. The undecideds that don't say things like "If (McCain or Obama) is elected, that's the end of our democracy!" They aren't voting for a guy just to vote against the other guy; they're voting for the guy they actually like more.

And in this election, John McCain is John Kerry. The guy who the base will vote for because they really don't like the other guy. But nobody else in that middle ground will have a compelling reason to vote for him. And just like Kerry, that'll be it for his campaign.

As far as Joe the plumber, he's a liar, how was he going to the money to pay for a business that would earn over 250K?

Do you know how much in assets and payroll he would have to pay for to accumulate that amount of income especially in OH?

He couldn't afford to pay 1200 in taxes, hell, I avg. that every 2 months and I don't make near 250K. His house is worth around 120K and he's behind in his taxes and had to rely on people paying 1200 to save his home.

He probably couldn't qualify for a used car loan.

Hudler wrote:

letsgocards89 wrote:Obama's prime-time ad skips over budget realities

No one wants to dicuss this?

Obama's assertion that "I've offered spending cuts above and beyond" the expense of his promises is accepted only by his partisans. His vow to save money by "eliminating programs that don't work" masks his failure throughout the campaign to specify what those programs are — beyond the withdrawal of troops from Iraq.

I have discussed it many times in this thread. I completely agree with the above, but as I've said multiple times, McCain plans to cut everyone's taxes while not proposing a single specific cut in spending other than the mysterious "pork". Even his pledge to freeze spending increases exempts the large majority of all spending. And unlike Obama, McCain doesn't seem very eager to scale back Iraq spending as quickly as possible.

If budget reality on the campaign trail is what you're looking for, I have no idea who you should support.

Arthur Dent wrote:What is the argument that a tax on consumption is better than a tax on income?

I can't speak to whether or not it would actually collect enough money to run the government, but the main argument in its favor is that it would promote savings, and that would translate into capitol investing.

InvincibleCakeEater wrote:Here's the stand up video.

[/youtube]

[expletive] man, that's bad. I felt sorry for McCain there, as I have since Labor Day. Sad to see him stoop to low levels, fall out of touch, and be played a fool.

...To be honest, I feel more warmth towards McCain than Obama, because he reminds me of my Dad and other guys of that generation. (Many who have passed.) Even though he wasn't my candidate of choice - through the first debate, I felt this warmth about McCain. (sorry for touchy feely Stuart Smalley talk) But clearly this campaign hasn't worked for him. Its more than about his lack of marketing skills - being president is just not what he's suited for.

Freed Roger wrote:

InvincibleCakeEater wrote:Here's the stand up video.

[/youtube]

[expletive] man, that's bad. I felt sorry for McCain there, as I have since Labor Day. Sad to see him stoop to low levels, fall out of touch, and be played a fool.

...To be honest, I feel more warmth towards McCain than Obama, because he reminds me of my Dad and other guys of that generation. (Many who have passed.) Even though he wasn't my candidate of choice - through the first debate, I felt this warmth about McCain. (sorry for touchy feely Stuart Smalley talk) But clearly this campaign hasn't worked for him. Its more than about his lack of marketing skills - being president is just not what he's suited for.

I said back in April that if it was Hillary over Obama, I might have considered voting McCain because he was such a moderate. The only thing that would have made me not at that time was the situation with Iraq. Until now. He's completely lost every bit of credibility as a politician I ever had for him and it's truly sad because I respected him tremendously and if I could have picked one Republican besides Ron Paul, I would have picked McCain or Giuliani. Now, I don't think I could ever like any of the people who ran in the (R) primaries.

BW23 wrote:

Popeye_Card wrote:

BW23 wrote:I love how someone can ask a presidential candidate a question on the campaign trail and have themselves dragged through the mud by the media. The scrutiny of Joe is beyond the ridiculous level.

I think people are just annoyed by his self-promotion and obvious grabbing of his 15 minutes of fame.

I will freely admit that I don't like it that news outlets immediately investigate these instant celebrities within minutes. I'm sure he's just an average Joe. It's the Republicans who made him a huge story, when there's not all that much particularly interesting about his situation.

The scrutiny took place immediately...digging into his past, looking for ways to put him down. And it wasn't just the news outlets.

Did the Republicans make him a huge story? Yeah, I guess. But it was because of the answer that Obama gave that set them off. "Spread the wealth". That's what started it all. And now, the best way to get people to ignore that is to paint Joe in a bad light.

Disgusting.

That is simply, unequivocally, undeniably, emphatically untrue. Obama spoke to Joe the Plumber on Sunday, October 12. Every dateline of every story about Joe the Plumber starts the evening of the debate, Oct. 15 because McCain mentioned him 20+ times. McCain first brought him up to the country. The stories that delve into Joe's history - lack of a license, owes taxes, etc. - the ones that you find disgusting, are usually dated at the earliest October 16. October 16. Which is four days after Obama talked to him, one day after McCain dragged him out for all of America to endure. Of course that didn't stop McCain from complaining a day or two later that the Obama campaign had ruined this poor guy's life. Which is probably the 'report' that you are basing this mistaken opinion on, I can only guess.

Provide a credible news source that has a dateline before October 15 that 'smears' Joe the Plumber and I will apologize profusely.