Stupid students who dont know they are stupid

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Spider John
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Re: Stupid students who dont know they are stupid

Post by Spider John »

sighyoung wrote:I And the chair was quite honest--no student has EVER complained about me in nineteen years of teaching, so the student's description of me as emotionally abusive and out of control (supposedly, I threw things around the room, and so on) didn't gibe with what others knew of me.
I deal with young people at church, and I've tried to impress upon them this very thing. Act like you should, and when a false accusation comes up, people who know you will have an idea whether it's legit or not.

I applaud both bosses for backing you guys up.

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a_smith
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Re: Stupid students who dont know they are stupid

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lukethedrifter wrote:I hope you two don't mind if I pass on your stories to this ridiculous friend of mine who wants to quit her job because she has a problem student.
Feel free to pass this on.

One of the hardest things to learn as a teacher is not take things personally.
I am not as good as I am according to the students who think I am the greatest, nor am I the evil demon terrorizing helpless young minds. Your friend shouldn't quit a good teaching job because of a student.
Last edited by a_smith on March 8 12, 7:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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G. Keenan
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Re: Stupid students who dont know they are stupid

Post by G. Keenan »

In my entire education I never challenged a grade or blamed the professor when I got a lower grade than I hoped for. I always thought I should have tried harder. It wouldn't even have occurred to me to challenge the grade on some technicality. If anything, professors usually grade too generously.

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Popeye_Card
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Re: Stupid students who dont know they are stupid

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G. Keenan wrote:In my entire education I never challenged a grade or blamed the professor when I got a lower grade than I hoped for. I always thought I should have tried harder. It wouldn't even have occurred to me to challenge the grade on some technicality. If anything, professors usually grade too generously.
I only thought about it once, and that was because I got a B on an easy test because I failed to show enough of my work on a problem that I got correct (that was a fairly simple calculation--I didn't think it needed detailed steps). This B ultimately led to me getting a B in the course rather than an A, so I thought of talking to the prof about it, but decided not to.

Then a year and a half later when I graduate, I end up with a 2.92 GPA. Had I gotten that A, I would have been at ~2.97, and could have rounded up on all of my resumes to a much better looking 3.0 than a 2.9. Oh well. That GPA hasn't hurt me thus far in my career.

Arthur Dent
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Re: Stupid students who dont know they are stupid

Post by Arthur Dent »

G. Keenan wrote:In my entire education I never challenged a grade or blamed the professor when I got a lower grade than I hoped for. I always thought I should have tried harder. It wouldn't even have occurred to me to challenge the grade on some technicality. If anything, professors usually grade too generously.
I think that's kind of foolish. There is nothing inherently wrong with challenging a grade. At least in technical classes where grading is somewhat more objective, I think it's smart and reasonable to stand up for yourself when there are errors in grading (not all that uncommon), when there is some point of interpretation, regarding partial credit when the solution is approached correctly but some algebra or arithmetic error is made, etc. It isn't necessary to be confrontational or pushy, and in every case but one, professors were more than happy to discuss grades and make changes where warranted.

The one exceptional case was a giant chemistry class (you may remember this) where they must have had a problem with excessive grade arguing with all the pre-med people. Instead of just going to office hours or talking after class, you had to write up your case. When I got a C on the mid-term, I was steamed as I felt that out of 10 problems, I had been unfairly docked on 5. The request was returned agreeing with most of what I argued and upgrading me to an A- with a note telling me that I should improve my tone. It turns out I still have this request saved on my computer, and reading it now, it is kinda pissy. Oh well.

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docellis
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Re: Stupid students who dont know they are stupid

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I don't think it is foolish to avoid arguing a grade, but I admit, it never occurred to me to try it.

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AdmiralKird
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Re: Stupid students who dont know they are stupid

Post by AdmiralKird »

It's just a letter grade. It's not going to change where you go in life. I'll argue a price or a decision all day if I see something wrong, but a few points or a letter grade... It's just not worth the hassle.

Arthur Dent
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Re: Stupid students who dont know they are stupid

Post by Arthur Dent »

docellis wrote:I don't think it is foolish to avoid arguing a grade, but I admit, it never occurred to me to try it.
I think it's appropriate and important to stand up for yourself when there are legitimate grievances. The classes where I argued grades were ones where I was putting in effort to understand and perform well, and if I felt there are mistakes in my evaluation, it seemed worthwhile to me to at least make a case for myself. In general, professors didn't have an issue with students making a polite, reasonable arguments, and I don't think doing so makes you an ass. If you care about the grades (maybe you shouldn't?) and they are low because of a mistake or misunderstanding, then why just put your head down?

greenback44
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Re: Stupid students who dont know they are stupid

Post by greenback44 »

As a math TA, I made a couple of simple typo-style mistakes, giving 3 points for a 10 point problem when I meant to give 7, for example. When you're grading 50 exams in two days, mistakes are liable to happen.

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G. Keenan
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Re: Stupid students who dont know they are stupid

Post by G. Keenan »

Arthur Dent wrote:
docellis wrote:I don't think it is foolish to avoid arguing a grade, but I admit, it never occurred to me to try it.
I think it's appropriate and important to stand up for yourself when there are legitimate grievances. The classes where I argued grades were ones where I was putting in effort to understand and perform well, and if I felt there are mistakes in my evaluation, it seemed worthwhile to me to at least make a case for myself. In general, professors didn't have an issue with students making a polite, reasonable arguments, and I don't think doing so makes you an ass. If you care about the grades (maybe you shouldn't?) and they are low because of a mistake or misunderstanding, then why just put your head down?
Yeah, I'm not saying students should never challenge a grade. Sometime professors make mistakes. In my case I think it would have been more difficult given I was usually writing essays where the grading is a bit more subjective and disputes would have come down to impressions of the success or failure of arguments and whatnot. But to initiate a personal war against a professor over a grade is just bizzarre. I honestly wonder if the students in this thread might have a mental illness or something.

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