Which Bullpen Goes North?

Hungary Jack · Post by **Hungary Jack** » March 18 07, 7:17 pm

The Deacon says we'll head north with 12 pitchters. Barring injury, I think these guys are locks:

Izzy (R)
Thompson (R)
Flores (L)

I think these are very probable to go north:

Rincon (L): TJ is a good bet, but he still has options, and I think Rincon may get the nod over him if their performances are comparable.
Hancock (R): Hasn't done anything to lose his job, but very replacable if he falters
Springer (R): If he's ready, he'll go north

I think these guys will be headed to the minors soon for more seasoning:
TJ
Hawksworth
Cate
Narveson (assuming he can clear waivers)

That still leaves a final slot for one of these guys:
Dove
Jimenez
Franklin (I don't think his deal is guaranteed)
Cavazos

I think TLR and Duncan want to see if Dove or Jimenez could possibly serve as a setup guy. Cavazos hasn't done anything to distinguish himself this spring, so is a longshot. Franklin seems like Josh Hancock with less stuff--I don't think he's a Cardinal come September.

picasso · Post by **picasso** » March 18 07, 7:40 pm

I think Narveson will be sent down with or without passing waivers (but perhaps the reason he hasn't pitched much is to allow him to pass thru?)

I never hear the Dynamic Duo say anything about Franklin, which is reminescent of Mike Myers, which leads me to believe he's gone via release or trade.

The way Tony's talking up Dove and Jimenez, makes it appear he wants a hard thrower in the pen.

If I was a gambling man I'd bet on one of those two.

Cronos · Post by **Cronos** » March 18 07, 7:49 pm

I'm pretty sure that guys like Cate, Narveson, Hawksworth, et al have already been assigned to minor level camp bound for AAA(or waivers or whatnot), have they not?

My gut tells me these are all but assured:

Izzy R
Thompson R
Hancock R
Springer R

Flores L
Rincon L

Leaving 1 open spot.

I also think they'll go with Rincon over TJ; TJ has options, they're paying Rincon pretty good cash still, and he certainly has deserved it more than TJ has with his Spring. TLR won't carry three lefties in the bullpen, so that last spot is going to one of the following:

Franklin
Dove
Jiminez
Falkenborg

I'm still debating in my mind as to which of those 4 gets the last spot.

Franklin's money IS guaranteed, 1 million. But as Picasso pointed out, not much at all has been heard or seen about Ryan Franklin, and he really hasn't looked all that good. It depends on whether they want to eat that money or not.

If I had MY druthers, I'd go with Falkenborg, Dove, or Jiminez. I'm not a Franklin fan. But if I had to predict, they'll probably take Franklin.

haltz · Post by **haltz** » March 18 07, 9:06 pm

Cronos69 wrote:I'm pretty sure that guys like Cate, Narveson, Hawksworth, et al have already been assigned to minor level camp bound for AAA(or waivers or whatnot), have they not?

Not Narveson as far as I know. I know that Keisler (and Ankiel) were reassigned today, and Cate and Hawksworth are already in Minor League camp.

According to Goold, Jimenez and Dove actually have legitimate chances to make the big club. Although, that'd be a hell of a jump for Dove, who hasn't had success above A-ball.

All of these guys would have to clear waivers or be outrighted, if they were not to make the team: Isringhausen, Narveson, Flores, Springer, Franklin, Rincon, and Hancock. So, that's seven guys right there.

The guys that are still in the mix, as far as I can tell, that do have options, or don't need one to be assigned are: Thompson, Jimenez, Dove, TJ, Cavazos and I'm not sure about Falkenborg. Probably forgetting someone there.

I think they'll try and pass Narvie through waivers or make him a throw-in, in a trade. I don't see him not being claimed if they try. But, I do have a feeling that Tyler will make the team. I think I read somewhere that he was working on a 2-seamer (or some pitch) and it was throwing off his the rest of his repertoire. If he has better outings in the next two weeks he should be on the team.

I would guess that Franklin may not make the team out of camp, same thing with Rincon perhaps. I also don't think that Dove or Jimenez have any sort of real shot.

Other than Springer, Izzy, Thompson and Flores I could see it going several ways for those last three spots.

valley_card22 · Post by **valley_card22** » March 19 07, 8:44 am

gotta feel Franklin is the odd man out. It would be a HUGE jump for Dove, but 97mph...to quote Major League "Thats some serious $*!T"

Hungary Jack · Post by **Hungary Jack** » March 19 07, 9:02 am

valley_card22 wrote:gotta feel Franklin is the odd man out. It would be a HUGE jump for Dove, but 97mph...to quote Major League "Thats some serious $*!T"

There are plenty of guys who throw 97+ in the bigs, and most major leaguer hitters don't have any problem keeping up with it. The key is 97+ with movement and location. Until Dove shows he can do it, he's just another Carmen Cali.

Post by **TheoSqua** » March 19 07, 10:35 am

Hungary Jack wrote:
valley_card22 wrote:gotta feel Franklin is the odd man out. It would be a HUGE jump for Dove, but 97mph...to quote Major League "Thats some serious $*!T"
There are plenty of guys who throw 97+ in the bigs, and most major leaguer hitters don't have any problem keeping up with it. The key is 97+ with movement and location. Until Dove shows he can do it, he's just another Carmen Cali.

Doesn't Looper throw 96 straight as an arrow?

Hungary Jack · Post by **Hungary Jack** » March 19 07, 10:41 am

TheoSqua wrote:
Hungary Jack wrote:
valley_card22 wrote:gotta feel Franklin is the odd man out. It would be a HUGE jump for Dove, but 97mph...to quote Major League "Thats some serious $*!T"
There are plenty of guys who throw 97+ in the bigs, and most major leaguer hitters don't have any problem keeping up with it. The key is 97+ with movement and location. Until Dove shows he can do it, he's just another Carmen Cali.
Doesn't Looper throw 96 straight as an arrow?

I don't know if he's gotten back to that velocity since his shoulder problems a few years ago. I think I've seen him as high as 95. But regardless of velocity, it's his struggles with location that gets him into trouble.

JL21 · Post by **JL21** » March 19 07, 11:35 am

Hungary Jack wrote:
valley_card22 wrote:gotta feel Franklin is the odd man out. It would be a HUGE jump for Dove, but 97mph...to quote Major League "Thats some serious $*!T"
There are plenty of guys who throw 97+ in the bigs, and most major leaguer hitters don't have any problem keeping up with it. The key is 97+ with movement and location. Until Dove shows he can do it, he's just another Carmen Cali.

You hit it right on the nose, Jack.

I'm not entirely impressed with Dove. We'll see. I like Jiminez more than Dove, though.

I think Franklin willl be the guy because they'll want insurance against Looper potentially imploding. I'd be quite surprised, really, if it's not Franklin. And I think Falkenbourg could do a serviceable job, too.

robbotis · Post by **robbotis** » March 19 07, 11:39 am

Hungary Jack wrote:
valley_card22 wrote:gotta feel Franklin is the odd man out. It would be a HUGE jump for Dove, but 97mph...to quote Major League "Thats some serious $*!T"
There are plenty of guys who throw 97+ in the bigs, and most major leaguer hitters don't have any problem keeping up with it. The key is 97+ with movement and location. Until Dove shows he can do it, he's just another Carmen Cali.

Only half MLB pitchers throw 90, so I wouldn't think to many throw 97. What only 10 or so average a 95 mph? And on the Cards 97 stands out.

http://www.actasports.com/sow.php?id=101"