We've Talked Reyes Plenty...How about Wainwright?

Cronos · Post by **Cronos** » April 30 07, 10:09 am

(Sorry if this has already been discussed in the Saturday game/post-game thread if there was one, I thought the topic deserved it's own thread).

1-2, 6.14 ERA, 1.88(ouch) WHIP.

1.31 K/BB ratio, .331 AVG allowed to opponents.

Joe Girardi discussed a bit on the FOX broadcast that he felt Wainwright was falling off the mound a bit, ie his mechanics were a bit out of whack. It's clear he's having control issues, and it seems to me his curveball hasn't really been there in any of his starts besides his first one.

Any ideas? Rookie(as a starter) growing pains? Problems?

jim · Post by **jim** » April 30 07, 10:13 am

He's rolling the curve up alot, I don't know if we just see more inconsistency in him because we see him in bigger doses or he just hasn't found it yet.

ToughGuy_BlueShirt · Post by **ToughGuy_BlueShirt** » April 30 07, 10:14 am

I said before he was even a starter that they should have kept him in the pen, so obviously I think he should be put in the pen. I'm not jumping the gun because I think he has talent and he could do well anywhere, but I think he could be a star as a closer. Izzy's done next year, groom him all this year as the closer and have him take over next year and you got your closer for the next 10 years. We're gonna need to push someone out of the rotation when Mulder gets back anyway.

The Red Sox did it, then the Phillies, now it's the Cardinals turn.

Dwtlr · Post by **Dwtlr** » April 30 07, 10:28 am

Sure he's struggling but who in their right mind didn't expect some pitfalls not only this year but probably next year as well as he learns to be a starter in ML..

First thing he needs to do is relax if possible..

So many people thought it would be like falling off a log to translate success from closer where you have to be good for about 15-20-pitches as opposed to a starter and be good for 110-pitches..I didn't..

You've made your bed starting basically two rookies in the rotation with expectations of contending..so you stick him out there every 5th day..and of course scoring a few runs early for him to work with wouldn't hurt..

The Cardinals are always talking about trusting your players..well here's a case where they almost have to..

Hungary Jack · Post by **Hungary Jack** » April 30 07, 11:27 am

Rare is the young starter who doesn't experience significant struggles early in his career. AW has the stuff, but he needs to learn how to throw it reliably and use it. This will take some time.

Post by **TheoSqua** » April 30 07, 11:57 am

AW's problem is that he isn't locating his out pitch. Hitters can lay off the curve cause it isn't going for strikes, and wait to nail the straigher stuff.

It's essentially what's plagued Brad Lidge, except that I think Lidge is a mechanical issue due to injury or overuse and Wainwright's is a mechanical issue due to being young and working in a new situation.

I always thought a 4.50 ERA from Adam this season would be ideal.

Fat Strat · Post by **Fat Strat** » April 30 07, 11:57 am

Hungary Jack wrote:Rare is the young starter who doesn't experience significant struggles early in his career. AW has the stuff, but he needs to learn how to throw it reliably and use it. This will take some time.

I agree. There's not much to say with AW, except that he has to pitch much better. When you can't control your curveball and you are having trouble throwing strikes with your fastball, you're going to get torched.

He just needs time.

Transmogrified Tiger · Post by **Transmogrified Tiger** » April 30 07, 12:21 pm

Obviously I'm coming from a more pessimistic/biased viewpoint, but I think there's reason to believe that Wainwright may not straighten out at all. When you look at what he did as a starter in the minors, he was pretty mediocre in two different years at AAA(compare to Reyes, who was pretty dominant in both of his). He obviously has the stuff to turn it around(or Schuerholz wouldn't have drafted him in the first round), but at the same time I think it begs to question whether Wainwright is capable of whatever adjustment he needs to make as a starter.

ToughGuy_BlueShirt · Post by **ToughGuy_BlueShirt** » April 30 07, 12:26 pm

Transmogrified Tiger wrote:Obviously I'm coming from a more pessimistic/biased viewpoint, but I think there's reason to believe that Wainwright may not straighten out at all. When you look at what he did as a starter in the minors, he was pretty mediocre in two different years at AAA(compare to Reyes, who was pretty dominant in both of his). He obviously has the stuff to turn it around(or Schuerholz wouldn't have drafted him in the first round), but at the same time I think it begs to question whether Wainwright is capable of whatever adjustment he needs to make as a starter.

I see you mentioned starter. Do you think he would be better suited for the pen, or do think he'll be mediocre where ever he is? I agree with you on the premise that he might not ever be an above average starter, but I think he could be special as a closer.

JL21 · Post by **JL21** » April 30 07, 12:31 pm

Transmogrified Tiger wrote:Obviously I'm coming from a more pessimistic/biased viewpoint, but I think there's reason to believe that Wainwright may not straighten out at all. When you look at what he did as a starter in the minors, he was pretty mediocre in two different years at AAA(compare to Reyes, who was pretty dominant in both of his). He obviously has the stuff to turn it around(or Schuerholz wouldn't have drafted him in the first round), but at the same time I think it begs to question whether Wainwright is capable of whatever adjustment he needs to make as a starter.

Of course, in one of those seasons, he was hurt for a chunk of it and ultimately was shut down. And in that other season, his peripherals- his K/9, his K/BB- were very good.